Strands #269 “Come Fly With...
Quizzes & Puzzles1 min ago
Patrick Moore: "The only food Kraut is a dead Kraut
Is there a time limit for hatred?
Let's bring race into it (hoorah, I hear you cry)...if a black chap from the Deep South who'd witnessed lynchings in the 40s and 50s had said, "The only good white man is a dead white man", would that be more or less shocking than what Mr Moore had said?
Indeed - should we be shocked at all?
http://www.dailymail....b-killed-fianc-e.html
Let's bring race into it (hoorah, I hear you cry)...if a black chap from the Deep South who'd witnessed lynchings in the 40s and 50s had said, "The only good white man is a dead white man", would that be more or less shocking than what Mr Moore had said?
Indeed - should we be shocked at all?
http://www.dailymail....b-killed-fianc-e.html
Answers
shed off the shackles of slavery
What do you actually mean?
It is (artfully but not helpfully) vague when compared with sp's very clear analogy with people alive today who saw loved ones killed by whites in the 1950s.
What do you actually mean?
It is (artfully but not helpfully) vague when compared with sp's very clear analogy with people alive today who saw loved ones killed by whites in the 1950s.
12:10 Tue 01st May 2012
AOG
Without wishing to sound disrespectful (which is what people always write before launching into something disrespectful), you seem to be saying that black people use slavery as leverage to 'guilt out' white people, but isn't that a bit simplistic?
It's like saying, "On January 8th 1833, slavery was abolished in England and literally from that day onward, black people were treated no differently to their white neighbours and looked forward to exactly the same opportunities in life.
History is the foundation that our houses are built on. There is a reason why some whites in the Deep South of America will never become senators.
There is a reason why the south of Spain is poorer than the north.
There is a reason why there is conflict between the people of Nepal and China.
History isn't like Dr Who where each story is a self-contained unit. It's more like Coronation Street...a drama where what happened years ago still reverberates today.
And before anyone criticises me, I would like to say that is a fantastic analogy.
Without wishing to sound disrespectful (which is what people always write before launching into something disrespectful), you seem to be saying that black people use slavery as leverage to 'guilt out' white people, but isn't that a bit simplistic?
It's like saying, "On January 8th 1833, slavery was abolished in England and literally from that day onward, black people were treated no differently to their white neighbours and looked forward to exactly the same opportunities in life.
History is the foundation that our houses are built on. There is a reason why some whites in the Deep South of America will never become senators.
There is a reason why the south of Spain is poorer than the north.
There is a reason why there is conflict between the people of Nepal and China.
History isn't like Dr Who where each story is a self-contained unit. It's more like Coronation Street...a drama where what happened years ago still reverberates today.
And before anyone criticises me, I would like to say that is a fantastic analogy.
I haven't read the whole thread but several things occur to me not the least of which is, in amongst abhorrance for hating a nation in it's entireity, that this is a very old gentlman. As one gets older, particularly very old, one starts to think backwards towards childhood and youth and things can seem to those people terrible all over again. He is very old, he is probably very lonely, he is probably thinking about the life he considers that the German's denied him, he is I think based on his age and personal experience allowed one crashing error of judgement and this is it. Much as I hate what he says, I feel far more sorry for the pain and hurt that he must still obviously feel than ever I am angry about it. I do however think that the interviewer who published the article could have had a bit more thought before he chose what to include and what to scrap as to me it's almost taking advantage of a very old man, living in the past and who can't let go of it.
atrocious acts committed against the Jews, the Bosnians, and even some evil perpetrations committed by blacks on other blacks on the continent of Africa, but these things are not forever being used as some form of lever.
On the contrary.
Any debate on Israel's behaviour (good and bad) soon produces 'holocaust leverage' both ways
Any debate on african politics soon throws up 'always fighting each other leverage'
that's what our understanding of where we come from does.
On the contrary.
Any debate on Israel's behaviour (good and bad) soon produces 'holocaust leverage' both ways
Any debate on african politics soon throws up 'always fighting each other leverage'
that's what our understanding of where we come from does.
I am not shocked in the least, he lost his first and only love, fought in a terrible war, and expect any number of friends. And for those soldiers, maybe not him, visited places like Belsen, it wasn't something they could forgive or forget. Many of the old guard who were prisoners of the Japanese never forgave them either.
many British soldiers, people, did not forgive the Japanese soldiers for their treatment in POW camps and on the death marches.
A friends father almost died at the hands of the Japanese soldiers. He came back to Britain from a Japanese POW camp skeletal. He wasn't very old when he eventually died. He suffered intestinal problems throughout his adult life due to the malnutrition and harsh treatment he received from Japanese soldiers. It wasn't something he spoke about often, but the few times you could get him to talk about it, it was always how much he loathed them.
As to not forgiving the Germans, well i know any number of people who held a grudge, even hatred for the Germans. That includes family who got bombed in the war, London was badly hit and many lost their lives.
As to Patrick Moore, he probably is irascible and crotchety, he comes over like that on the TV. But his attitude doesn't surprise me in the least.
A friends father almost died at the hands of the Japanese soldiers. He came back to Britain from a Japanese POW camp skeletal. He wasn't very old when he eventually died. He suffered intestinal problems throughout his adult life due to the malnutrition and harsh treatment he received from Japanese soldiers. It wasn't something he spoke about often, but the few times you could get him to talk about it, it was always how much he loathed them.
As to not forgiving the Germans, well i know any number of people who held a grudge, even hatred for the Germans. That includes family who got bombed in the war, London was badly hit and many lost their lives.
As to Patrick Moore, he probably is irascible and crotchety, he comes over like that on the TV. But his attitude doesn't surprise me in the least.
"As to not forgiving the Germans, well i know any number of people who held a grudge, even hatred for the Germans. That includes family who got bombed in the war, London was badly hit and many lost their lives.
Yes so did many Germans in Dresden courtesy of us .
There are two sides to every story .
People who hold grudges usually turn out to be bitter like Mr Moore .It's a great shame he's harboured this bitterness all his life when he could have moved on and found someone else to share his life with .
I find his remarks extremely offensive .
Yes so did many Germans in Dresden courtesy of us .
There are two sides to every story .
People who hold grudges usually turn out to be bitter like Mr Moore .It's a great shame he's harboured this bitterness all his life when he could have moved on and found someone else to share his life with .
I find his remarks extremely offensive .
On a bit of a tangent here ....
but wasn't Patrick Moore's beloved 'conquest of space' that did much to elevate his own professional status actually based on the work of the 'Kraut' rocket engineers such as Werner von Braun?
The USA grabbed most of them in '45 and whisked them off to the states to develop the NASA launch vehicles including the Saturn V.
but wasn't Patrick Moore's beloved 'conquest of space' that did much to elevate his own professional status actually based on the work of the 'Kraut' rocket engineers such as Werner von Braun?
The USA grabbed most of them in '45 and whisked them off to the states to develop the NASA launch vehicles including the Saturn V.
'If certain sections of our community are not prepared to forget Britain's involvement in the slave trade...' Phew ! That rules out the Muslims then. They were , historically, slave traders [ from the same source]
...or the Empire...' Oh dear! They're back in again, 'sleeping with the enemy'.
Plenty of people, and some 'community (or communities)', in America don't forget segregation ( and discriminatory laws, too). They can't, then, be fully integrated and 'are sleeping with the enemy'. I wonder which country they should go to, rather than remaining in the one where they were born.
Strange thing is, they don't get called 'anti-American' if they recall that, complain of it, or criticise the country for allowing or encouraging it. But some people over here are called 'anti-British' for recalling, complaining of, or criticising, this country for allowing or encouraging some conduct in this country's past.
Why is that?
...or the Empire...' Oh dear! They're back in again, 'sleeping with the enemy'.
Plenty of people, and some 'community (or communities)', in America don't forget segregation ( and discriminatory laws, too). They can't, then, be fully integrated and 'are sleeping with the enemy'. I wonder which country they should go to, rather than remaining in the one where they were born.
Strange thing is, they don't get called 'anti-American' if they recall that, complain of it, or criticise the country for allowing or encouraging it. But some people over here are called 'anti-British' for recalling, complaining of, or criticising, this country for allowing or encouraging some conduct in this country's past.
Why is that?
there are no winners in war, ever, so best not start one. If Herr Hitler had not thought it would be a jolly idea to march into Poland, and in fact almost anywhere he pleased, there wouldn't have been 90 odd millions souls lost, in WW2, but as it turned out, he did. I am not condoning what happened in Dresden, just explaining for many they found it hard to forgive.
because some think we should, governments can and have apologised on our behalf in this and other matters, but as i said before on the other thread, how can we know if our ancestors where complicit in any way, culpable. Even Jno said that perhaps i should receive an apology, seeing as my family came from Ireland originally. I don't feel the need, want any apology from anyone over any hardships, problems that may have happened to them.
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