ChatterBank3 mins ago
How could they do this
Catholic or no they should have helped this poor woman
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Answers
You'll find Em that I will only defend Ireland when it's worth defending and that as my home country I recognise full well our failings in many departments. It makes me sick to my stomach that we are still acting in such a medieval way towards women in need of help, that doesn't lessen my love of the country just makes me a realist about some of the cruel and peculiar...
19:57 Wed 14th Nov 2012
"i also remember reading some years ago the statistics on Irish women who have had abortions in England, time they got out of the dark ages.. "
But as you probably know, and as the BBC sideline mentions, it's not so much "dark ages" as fudge. Successive Irish Govts can appease the church by going along with the law, whilst at the same time knowing that there is always the "British option"
But as you probably know, and as the BBC sideline mentions, it's not so much "dark ages" as fudge. Successive Irish Govts can appease the church by going along with the law, whilst at the same time knowing that there is always the "British option"
I am ashamed to say that this happened because Ireland is a narrow minded backward country with it's legal and social establishments entrenched firmly with the church. We have a lot of growing up to do and seem incapable of dragging our languid, pious, self righteous carcasses into the 21st century, preferring instead to hide behind ' God' and 'tradition' at the expense of anyone and anything. I'm not remotely surprised that this happened coming as it does form the country that brought you the Magdalene Laundries ( the last of which closed in 1996, I mean 1996 for God's sake) and many more atrocities against it's own innocent children and women. I wasted the first half of my life fighting for a myth that Ireland is something wonderful and this disgusts me beyond words, but sadly doesn't surprise me one iota.
You'll find Em that I will only defend Ireland when it's worth defending and that as my home country I recognise full well our failings in many departments. It makes me sick to my stomach that we are still acting in such a medieval way towards women in need of help, that doesn't lessen my love of the country just makes me a realist about some of the cruel and peculiar people who still have authority there.
Hopefully an inquiry will establish what actually happened.
Abortion is legal in Ireland if the patient's life at risk, and it isn't clear if that was the case here.
It also isn't clear to me whether refusing to induce a doomed foetus is actually illegal in Ireland under any circumstances.
It does seem clear that the alleged remarks made to the patient were wholly insensitive, and quite possibly inaccurate to boot.
What is also clear is that the law needs to be changed in Ireland as soon as possible.
Abortion is legal in Ireland if the patient's life at risk, and it isn't clear if that was the case here.
It also isn't clear to me whether refusing to induce a doomed foetus is actually illegal in Ireland under any circumstances.
It does seem clear that the alleged remarks made to the patient were wholly insensitive, and quite possibly inaccurate to boot.
What is also clear is that the law needs to be changed in Ireland as soon as possible.
This is a desperately sad situation for everyone involved.
It is very easy to write a snap headline that infers that this poor woman was denied a termination on the basis of religion, but a cursory glance at the back story confirms that the situation is not that simple - as they rarely are.
My view on abortion - which is a constantly vexing moral issue - has settled on the rights of the mother being paramount - if she needs an abortion, she should be able to have one - it is not for total strangers to enforce their own moral views on inidividuals based on a dogmatic viewpoint.
I understand application of the law and support that concept entirely, but it does seem as though protection of the unborn child has failed by the virtue of that protection which has taken the mother's life as well.
I would reiterate though, that this is not a simple case of 'We're Catholics - no abortions here ...' which is the implcation the headline writers point us towards.
I can never condone the rules of church in any situation - if you don't play the game, don't make the rules.
It is very easy to write a snap headline that infers that this poor woman was denied a termination on the basis of religion, but a cursory glance at the back story confirms that the situation is not that simple - as they rarely are.
My view on abortion - which is a constantly vexing moral issue - has settled on the rights of the mother being paramount - if she needs an abortion, she should be able to have one - it is not for total strangers to enforce their own moral views on inidividuals based on a dogmatic viewpoint.
I understand application of the law and support that concept entirely, but it does seem as though protection of the unborn child has failed by the virtue of that protection which has taken the mother's life as well.
I would reiterate though, that this is not a simple case of 'We're Catholics - no abortions here ...' which is the implcation the headline writers point us towards.
I can never condone the rules of church in any situation - if you don't play the game, don't make the rules.
each report i have read, listened to and watched on the news said the same thing. So it's up to the woman's poor husband to sort it out with the aid of the legal profession. I don't think it's a mistake, the woman was clearly in distress, and they should have acted accordingly. You may not see it as such but that is how it reads.
Savita Halappanavar, 31, was 17 weeks pregnant when she developed back pain and tests revealed that she would lose her baby.
But despite her repeated pleas over three days, doctors refused to perform a termination as they could still hear the foetus’s heartbeat, reportedly telling her: "This is a Catholic country."
Mrs Halappanavar’s condition rapidly deteriorated and she died after developing septicaemia four days after the death of her baby.
The case has prompted renewed calls for the Irish government to legislate for abortion, with pro-choice campaigners branding her death “an outrage”.
James Reilly, Ireland’s health minister, sought a report on the circumstances surrounding the tragedy and Galway University Hospital prepared to launch its own investigation.
But despite her repeated pleas over three days, doctors refused to perform a termination as they could still hear the foetus’s heartbeat, reportedly telling her: "This is a Catholic country."
Mrs Halappanavar’s condition rapidly deteriorated and she died after developing septicaemia four days after the death of her baby.
The case has prompted renewed calls for the Irish government to legislate for abortion, with pro-choice campaigners branding her death “an outrage”.
James Reilly, Ireland’s health minister, sought a report on the circumstances surrounding the tragedy and Galway University Hospital prepared to launch its own investigation.
