Has The Welfare System Created A Monster?

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/article-2303071/Michael-Philpotts-story-shows-pervasiveness-evil-born-welfare-dependency.html

Do you agree that the welfare system, the concept of which at first was a blessing, has now created a monster, as has been shown in this tragic case?

It has created a completely different species of human being, as has been shown with the various individuals interviews over this case, they tend to have a different look from the norm, so much so that some are have even been given a name, 'CHAVs'.

These are not the usual 'poor', in fact there are many who live in council houses, (now called social housing) who may not be 'well off' but are decent hard working people, who not only take a pride in themselves but also tend to live to a certain standard of morals.

/// Philpott had also fathered another six children by three other women. As far as can be known, he never contributed so much as a penny towards the upkeep of any of these 17 children, all of whom were born into dependency on state benefits. ///

/// His story throws into surreal relief the row between the Tories and Labour this week about Iain Duncan Smith’s much-needed benefit reforms. While the Left and the Church cry that they are unfair and immoral, the Government argues calmly that what is immoral is leaving families such as Michael Philpott’s to languish on benefits for generations. ///

/// Indeed, Philpott never even attempted to find a job. The children owed their existence to his desire to milk the welfare system. ///

[sara3]

there's no limit. if they're still "dependent" and live with you..

[ummmm]

There is a cap actually. Isn't it 26k? That wouldn't effect child benefit though. I don't think it would effect working tax credits either.

[Sqad]

Well, i stand to be corrected her but in the late 40's and early fifties, I was born "out of wedlock" and brought up by my grandparents. my biological mother claimed child benefit and gave it to my grandparents.
When she had children of her own, the question of my birth particulars came into question as there was a limit to how many children for which one could claim.

If that was the case (and i cannot be sure) then the "Benefits System" has indeed...."created a Monster."

[humbersloop]

benefits cap only comes into effect in a few london boroughs on 15 april ummm, then gets phased in over the rest of the country july-september

[friedgreentomato]

At the moment there is no upper limit for child tax credit or child benefit.

[ummmm]

Cheers Humber :-)

[jackthehat]

Child Benefit wasn't payable for on only child, sqad, until 1977; prior to that it was payable for every child *except* the eldest..........

[ummmm]

Sqad, child benefits replaced tax breaks. It just shifted the money from the main breadwinner to the main carer.

Too many children were going hungry because the main breadwinner kept finding themselves in the pub.

[Sqad]

JTH...right.....so my mother didn't receive any child benefit to give to my grandmother.

O.K thanks.

Then I feel that i have to agree with AOG...there "seems" to have been a significant escalation in benefits over the past half century.

[Sqad]

ummmm

\\\Too many children were going hungry because the main breadwinner kept finding themselves in the pub. \\\\

Well, purely anecdotally and coming from a "working class" family in the poorest and deprived area of a large town.........I never came across any of my "mates" at school "going hungry."

[Old_Geezer]

26k ? That's a lot of kids ! Pity the poor mother.

[ummmm]

You think kids announced it when they arrived at school?

We are no longer a society of people that keep schtum and sweep things under the carpet.

[humbersloop]

difficult to say in relative terms sqad, but as 47% of the entire welfare spend goes on state pensions, would it be reasonable to suggest we've created several generations of "different species of human beings" in pensioners?

[Sqad]

ummmm....right.

In many ways society was closer than it is today.......neighbourly interest and concern..........so probably we would have got a clue of the "hungry child."

[Sqad]

humber....LOL....don't understand your point.....but it sounds "intellectual"..;-)

[ummmm]

You wouldn't have a clue. You just think you would. Kids are great at keeping secrets.

[friedgreentomato]

Sqad, I appreciate that my father is younger than you but he and his siblings often went to school hungry as did many of their friends as it was after the war.

Thats not to say that my grandparents were bad parents it was just there was not enough food about. They did not brag about being hungry it was just accepted and managed.

[daffy654]

In my childhood (1970s)I was always glad when my mum put me in care, or she went to prison, or the social workers took us away because it meant we would get fed regularly. My mum used to spend all the benefits on herself and we 7 kids would be given a loaf of dry bread and a packet of biscuits and told to f**k off out for the day and not come home till it was dark. We never mentioned it to anyone at school.

[Sqad]

Well, as has been suggested, as you get older your memory either fails or plays tricks upon you......

[factor-fiction]

Hi squad- humbersloop is saying that if indeed the welfare system 'has created a completely different species of human being' then that would include pensioners since 47% of welfare spending actually goes on state pensions.