Is This Close To The Truth

[sp1814]

How much truth is there in this thought-provoking piece:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/2013/apr/08/margaret-thatcher-death-etiquette

[DangerUXD]

Yes I've read it, he basically says "why can't we sl&g off the dead", it does mention MrsT mainly because she dared to mention Mr Mandella.

[DangerUXD]

On that basis trigger MrsT is the direct result of Union dogma!

[LazyGun]

It says nothing of the sort Danger. It does point out that there are those like you that wish to stifle dissent and free speech of those who wish to point out just how divisive she was.

Like I say, you continually assert propaganda of "left wing teachers", without recognising the propaganda contained within your own post - an example of objective assessment they are not...

[Barmaid]

I think he's partly right and partly wrong.

There is an odd culture of "not speaking ill of the dead". Well I take the view that because I disagreed with someone in life, I can still disagree with them when they are dead. However, there is a HUGE difference about not speaking ill of the dead (ie saying why you think she was wrong/did damage etc) and some of the frankly inhuman comments I have read over the last 24 hours - not least to do with disposal of her remains (which I shall not repeat).

I am not sure what it is about the death of a controversial public figure which brings out the worst in human nature (we saw a similar thing, although far more sycophantic with Diana). The sycophants go marching off in one direction - those diametrically opposed go off in another. Neither side do themselves any favours. The choice seems to be between beatification and demonisation and there appears to be no mid way course.

[Sqad]

trigger...i am always worried about the concept of "cause and effect" it is used a lot in scientific matters, but the effect is not necessarily the cause....but it is a phrase that slips nicely off the tongue.

Interestingly Ken Livingstone and Tony Benn, although disagreeing with her policies, manage to extol her obvious virtues as a Prime Minister.

Also interestingly enough we have not heard a word from Neil Kinnock who was a serious adversary..............it would have been a nice gesture perhaps.

[emmie]

Livingstone didn't extol her virtues, he was on the news last evening and features in todays paper, his words are what you would expect, she kicked his backside and he didn't care for that. As to Kinnock, he has had his say too, why wouldn't he...

[youngmafbog]

Typical left wing Guardian drivel and I certainly don't need to be lectured by a left wing American journalist.

There are much better articles on the BBC, for once unbiased pointing out both sides of the coin.

SP, do you really think it is appropriate for the left wingers to be celebrating someones death? I myself would never do that despite how much I despise people. For instance I can assure you I would not even consider celebrating Browns death despite him wrecking the country. (I chose this as the left continually accuse Thatcher of ruining the county, whilst conveniently forgetting she inherited it broken)

As for rubbing oneself down with the Guardian, I am proud to say I have done it a few times. The Guardian is often free as they cant shift it and being large makes really good bog paper

[Sqad]

em.......i must have watched a different interview.

[youngmafbog]

Squad, Kinnokio ha is head too deep in the EU trough. Probably not heard about it his head is in so far !

[emmie]

this is what he said in an interview alongside David Mellor.
Former London Mayor Ken Livingstone doesn’t agree though and holds Thatcher accountable for the banking, housing and benefit crises of today.

He said: “If you go back and look at the opinion polls in the 1970s, the Brits were the third happiest people in the world.

[emmie]

not sure how he worked that out, but it's a load of tosh.

[sp1814]

em10 - already explained earlier!!

[jno]

very true. I have no problem with "respecting the grief of a family" whom I actually know, but why should I respect the grief of Baron Mark Thatcher? It's not as though I got a telegram from him when my Mum died; he's a total stranger, and I owe him nothing whatever. (In fact I think that, unlike his mother, he's a pustule on the bum of humanity, so there.)

Respect has to be earned; it doesn't come automatically just because you're in the public eye, even if you're an elected politician. People I know personally will have done that already. Public figures may or may not have done so.

[sp1814]

youngmafbog

SP, do you really think it is appropriate for the left wingers to be celebrating someones death?

Absolutely not.

Where would you get that idea?

Have you not seen my posts from yesterday?

Silly suggestion. Really silly.

This thread is about opposing views being suffocated due to 'respect'. I am asking whether this should be appropriate for public figures?

[sp1814]

youngmafbog

Pound for pound - The Guardian makes better toilet paper than the Mail (number of pages divided by cost).

I'll give you that...

[Bazile]

One mans terriost , is another man's freedom fighter .

All leaders including the lady in question chose/ chooses one or the another , as it suits

[Bazile]

Incidentally , why was she living in the Ritz?

[Sharingan]

I must say that I have tried to be respectful yet still point out that I disagree with nearly everything she did. I wasnt around at the time so any information I have used to gain my opinion is based on what I have read, heard, seen on TV programmes or researched. Having given it some serious though ( prior to her dying) I came to the conclusion that she caused more harm than she did good. I voiced this politely and someone immediately 'corrected' me.
It's all very well being respectful of the dead but to stifle opinion on their misdemeanors and errors is another thing entirely and that is certainly happening now. Bow down to that and as someone said earlier future generations trying to research her ( like me) will have a very distorted view of the effect she had and how she was percieved.

[jno]

Bazile, she was a guest of the owners of the Ritz, who are also the owners of the Daily Telegraph (but choose to live in tax exile in the Channel Islands)