Execution Of Prisoners

[jake-the-peg]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/uknews/defence/10432095/Recording-of-Royal-Marines-accused-of-murdering-Taliban-prisoner-released.html

Court marshals have the same sentencing powers as civillian courts but are they under the same mandatary rules?

If these Royal Marines are found guilty of this murder will we see the same life sentences that a civillian would have to hand down?

Or will we see more suspended sentences like Danny Nightingale?

Will they be named if found guilty?

[Brenden]

Fender, you misunderstood me, I agree with you where Islam is concerned, when I mentioned fear 24/7 it was for our men -

[trt]

##so he could come back and kill another soldier, after all that was him aim, he failed, its not like ww2 these guys think there on a mission from god, now he is with his god##

And the 30 Virgins!

[bazwillrun]

from article 3 of the Geneva convention

"To this end, it is prohibited to pass sentences on prisoners or carry out executions without a constituted court judgement. Prisoners may not be harmed, degraded, humiliated or taken hostage.

Under the convention, the wounded and sick should be collected and cared for by an impartial humanitarian body, such as the Red Cross."

perhaps they should make this clear to the scum our military have to fight, for the most part with their hands tied behind their back.

[anotheoldgit]

emmie

/// they could simply have left him be, he might have died anyway, he was injured, however they chose not to do that, a bullet to the chest made sure of his death. ///

One could say that instead of leaving him alone in agony they shot him, which is the humane way isn't it?

[sandyRoe]

Cruel to be kind? That's a novel defence to the charge of murder.

[FredPuli43]

Yes, he really wanted to be shot dead, rather than helped any more, or at all, so I shot him. Not sure that is a defence ! But worse, it is not even moral.

[anotheoldgit]

emmie

You have made very many comments on this all condemning these soldiers, yes a few niceties were dismissed, but surely in the circumstances they could be excused to certain extent.

I notice that you are female and I don't want to appear sexist, but what would your feelings be about those mothers who abandon their new born babies in bushes, or some of the murders that have been committed by females only to be excused for such reasons as postnatal depression etc?

Well unless you have been in a war like situation you have no idea what these soldiers have to endure from the time they open their eyes to the time they close them, each and every day, they can't just switch off and go and enjoy a cup of coffee, you have no idea, so please try and put yourself in these young chaps position, because it is very easy to pass judgement from the comfort of your home.

[THECORBYLOON]

ANOTHEOLDGIT, I do not know all the details of this case but were the soldiers' lives in immediate danger, were they reacting in the heat of battle, were they under pressure to make a split-second decision? Post-natal depression affects mental capacity but in the extract I heard, the soldier seemed to be in enough possession of his mental faculties to know what he was doing was wrong and contravened the Geneva Conventions.

[anotheoldgit]

THECORBYLOON

/// Post-natal depression affects mental capacity but in the extract I heard, the soldier seemed to be in enough possession of his mental ///

How does anyone know what the state of this soldier's mental capacity was?

It could have built up over the time he had spent in daily action, he could have been wind up like a clock spring, and at that particular instance he just snapped, who knows what went through his mind as he looked down on that member of the Taliban?

Do we not hear of some who have come home from Afghanistan and who's whole life has changed, some even to finish up committing serious crimes themselves.

[FredPuli43]

That,of course, AOG, is why we have different levels of minimum sentence for murder. Some murders are worse than others, though all are murders. Some murders are made manslaughter, not murder, because of what we call 'diminished responsibility', a kind of temporary insanity in an otherwise sane person. Infanticide is not murder because the mother's mind is unbalanced by the birth and its after effects.

It could be open to a soldier to plead 'diminished responsibility' and for manslaughter to be the verdict. That is, he was then suffering some such abnormality of mind [very broadly defined; it may cover extreme provocation causing a normal person to 'snap'] as to substantially impair his responsibility for his acts or omissions in killing. For murders after October the 4th 2010, a new law applies, redefining this defence more precisely, but it does not alter the fundamental principle.

The importance of this is that there is no mandatory sentence for manslaughter . The defendant could get anything from a conditional discharge to life imprisonment

[FredPuli43]

We might think of the Great War. Over 300 of our men were shot at dawn. Some had exemplary records, some had even been commended for bravery, yet they were shot for deliberate absence, or for throwing down their rifle when in action or other acts of apparent cowardice. Many of these men were plainly suffering from shell shock. True, that none of them murdered anybody, but had they done so in present times, diminished responsibility would probably have provided a successful defence

[jno]

FredPuli, I believe the shooting of deserters had been abandoned by the time of WW2. Perhaps it had been found not to encourager les autres after all.

[THECORBYLOON]

If the soldier's mental condition at that particular time were an issue or defence, would there not be medical reports carried out to substantiate that claim? I have no idea what like his mental state was, only an impression but the Court and those delivering the verdict are the ones who knew all the evidence as presented and they were satisfied of the man was guilty.

[pixie373]

Exactly, corbyloon...

[FredPuli43]

Indeed, jno, shooting deserters had been abandoned by WW2. In that war, only two people subject to military law were executed. One had murdered someone and one was guilty of aiding the enemy by espionage.

[emmie]

AOG, being female has no basis in this, i can make comments, judgements and indeed decisions based on my own sense, not because i am female, and have no idea what this has to do with post natal depressed women.
Soldiers in war time do bad things, some good things, and this was not a good thing, the man may well have died, did you actually listen to the footage, the comments by the three soldiers, the wording is enough to make you wonder at their state of mind, laughing as the man is shot, and the fact he says he has just broken the Geneva convention, so he, they know it wasn't right. i agree that in war time, which by the way this is not, terrible things happen, but this was not right at all.

[Brenden]

Why should our troops have their hands tied with the Geneva convention when the taliban laugh at it - not a level playing field, I certainly would not have turned my back on the prisioner injured or not, just do not trust them one iota. As we have said constantly, we are infidels in their eyes to be lied too, killed etc they are brainwashed by this religion from the moment they are born - I have no idea what the solution is, but trust is not one of them.

[FredPuli43]

AOG, this court martial, in common with all courts martial of soldiers, had a board ("jury") of warrant officers and above, consisting in this case of 7 officers. You may think that are familiar with the stresses of war, in Afghanistan and elsewhere. If they aren't, it's difficult to see what 'jury' would have had such experience. And they are not debarred by being female.