David Cameron Says This Is A Christian Country

[emmie]

is he wrong, if so why, he has been roundly pilloried for his comments by any number of scientists, academics, and so forth,

[jno]

I don't like the presence of religious leaders in the House of Lords, or the public money used to support faith schools (or Eton, for that matter) at the expense of secular schools; the state as a whole should leave religion to individuals. But I don't have a problem with the notion that Britain is still a Christian country; the ethics inculcated over the centuries by the church are still deeply ingrained in British culture.

[mikey4444]

Not sure why dave has to make comments of this sort at all. He should concentrate of governing the country in a fair and judicious manner, not pontificate on irrelevant issues like religion. Perhaps he can start by investigating why some many more people are relying on Food Banks since May 2010.

But yes, he is wrong. We are a very mixed bunch here in Britain these days but the majority of us are lazy non-believers. I worked on the 2011 Census and helped people complete their forms and I lost count of those that said, when it came to the religion question " Well, Christian I suppose but I never got to church"

Being a bit Christian is a like being a bit pregnant, you either are or you are not. Don't even get me on the subject of Agnostics !...Even more lazy !

Something that always irritates me is this attitude amongst some people that in order to be a fine upstanding member of your community, you have to a Christian. What arrogant nonsense !

[anotheoldgit]

This from the Daily Mail's readers comments,

"Perhaps Britain is now just a god-forsaken place"?

I wonder who made it that way.

[Gromit]

Daily Mail readers seem to knock Britain at every opportunity.

[jno]

Don't even get me on the subject of Agnostics !...Even more lazy !

That's silly. Agnosticism is saying you don't know - or, if you put it more rigorously, that we can never know. How people can *know* that there is or isn't a god is beyond me; it simply isn't provable either way, and you can only believe what you believe. Laziness has nothing whatever to do with it.

[anotheoldgit]

mikey4444

/// Something that always irritates me is this attitude amongst some people that in order to be a fine upstanding member of your community, you have to a Christian. What arrogant nonsense ! ///

No you have it wrong, it does not matter what one calls themselves, just as long as one follows a certain moral lifestyle that has been based on Christian beliefs that have been instilled in our culture over many years.

One also does not have to attend a man made building so as to pray en-mass to be classed a Christian, that free choice is up to the individual, just as long as one adheres to the basic principles of Christianity, that is enough to be classed a Christian.

[Gromit]

Tony Blair called himself a Christian.
Then joined the invasion of Iraq killing hundreds of thousands of innocents.

[THECORBYLOON]

ANOTHEOLDGIT, you said'One also does not have to attend a man made building so as to pray en-mass to be classed a Christian, that free choice is up to the individual, just as long as one adheres to the basic principles of Christianity, that is enough to be classed a Christian.' Jesus said there was none more important than the second Commandment yet you do not show much love for your neighbours if they are not English, white or Christian. Can you say you are a true Christian?

[mikey4444]

Agnosticism is just another way of saying that you just can't be bothered to find out one way or the other. You either believe in the concept of religion or you don't. You can't leave the door open to an important issue like belief in the supernatural, just in case "it might be true" Its like saying the Tooth Fairy might exist because you can't proves that it doesn't. It is intellectual laziness in its purest form.

Agnostics should get of their a*ses, and the fence, and make up their minds, not sit around with a bemused look on their faces, waiting for some kind of enlightenment.

AOG...with respect, you are talking nonsense. You are either a Christian or you are not. Being a Christian means that you think that the son of god descended down from Heaven, caused a few miracles to happen and so badly pissed off the Pharisees and the Romans that they executed him, which was a silly thing to do because a few days later he came back from the dead and went back up to Heaven again. Being a nice person and following the general good behaviour that is similar to the Ten Commandments has nothing to do with being a Christian whatsoever. For instance, Buddhists or Hindus think murder is wrong, as well as everybody else, but nobody describes them as having "Christian beliefs" for having such views. What arrogance !

[anotheoldgit]

/// Daily Mail readers seem to knock Britain at every opportunity. ///

/// Tony Blair called himself a Christian. ///
/// Then joined the invasion of Iraq killing hundreds of thousands of
innocents. ///

How long have you been a Daily Mail reader Gromit?

But then Saddam Hussain killed hundreds of thousands of innocents, and wasn't he Muslim, but you wouldn't dare criticise the Islamic faith now would you?

[jno]

agnostics have made up their minds. They know they do not know. And it has nothing to do with "the concept of religion" - anyone who doesn't believe the concept of religion exists must wonder what it is they're debating in R&S.

[jno]

aog, Saddam may have ruled a Muslim country but it was on a secular basis - like Turkey or Libya, but unlike Saudi Arabia, for instance.

This was part of the problem: ruling as a purely secular tyrant just gave religious hardliners a rallying point.

[naomi24]

Mikey, re: agnostics. As you said to AOG, with respect you are talking nonsense - but I don't have time to tell you why right now. I'll try to get back later.

[mikey4444]

I shall look forward to hearing from you naomi !

[vulcan42]

"An agnostic position is one that leaves open the question whether there exists a god or gods, professing to find such a question unanswered or unanswerable. For the atheist, the question has been answered, and in the negative."
-Jaroslav Pelikan
There must be some strange dictionaries around where a synonym of laziness is unanswerable.

[anotheoldgit]

THECORBYLOON

/// Jesus said there was none more important than the second Commandment yet you do not show much love for your neighbours if they are not English, white or Christian. Can you say you are a true Christian? ///

Seems strange that some who speak against Christianity and state that Jesus didn't exist, are so quick to quote from the scriptures written in that 'Fairy Story Book' they often refer to the Bible as.

Before quoting the second commandment make sure you know the 10 Commandments, I think you will find the second one refers to Graven Images etc.

And now referring to your wrongful assumption that I show no love to anyone who is not English, white or Christian, please tell me that I am wrong to criticise or even condemn and show no love to anyone who is not English, but is black, none Christian, if they have been found to have committed evil and violent acts against others?

[anotheoldgit]

mikey4444

/// AOG...with respect, you are talking nonsense. You are either a Christian or you are not. Being a Christian means that you think that the son of god descended down from Heaven, caused a few miracles to happen and so badly pissed off the Pharisees and the Romans that they executed him, which was a silly thing to do because a few days later he came back from the dead and went back up to Heaven again. ///

It is you who is talking nonsense, (pardon the insult but you started it) how do you as an atheist know what it takes to be a Christian?

One does not have to believe word for word everything from a book that was written from a collection of other books by certain persons many, many years ago, even now many stories get misinterpreted and lost in their translation.

/// Being a nice person and following the general good behaviour that is similar to the Ten Commandments has nothing to do with being a Christian whatsoever. For instance, Buddhists or Hindus think murder is wrong, as well as everybody else, but nobody describes them as having "Christian beliefs" for having such views. What arrogance ! ///

I think you will find that Christian beliefs have an edge over some other religions, one has only to witness what others are prepared to do, but funny that is one religion you failed to point out.

[mikey4444]

vulcan...Surely it can't be terribly difficult to see that Christianity can't possibly be true? The Bible is stuffed full of ludicrous stories, such as miracles, Noah's Ark, changing water into wine, Jonah and the Whale, etc, etc. All the other religions are the same, full of daft things. For example, how credulous would you have to be, to think that Scientology is actually true ?

As I have said on another thread over the weekend, religion is all about the irrational belief in illogical circumstances. I am reasonable educated and highly rational, so I can't possibly think that any religion "might" be true.

So, to just say that you can't possibly make up your mind whether it is true or not, is just what I have described.

[Baldric]

Christian Supremacy rules eh?

[Gromit]

// One does not have to believe word for word everything //

Pick 'n' Mix religion is always the best.

// I think you will find that Christian beliefs have an edge over some other religions //

Followers of every religion believe that their version is superior to the others. It isn't, they are just arrogant.