Charlotte Church - 'the Real World'

[agchristie]

Following Charlotte's appearance on Question Time, does she have a point about Syria?

Does anybody know what is meant these days when referring to the real world anyway?

[Khandro]

Who's Charlotte Church ?

[Zacs-Master]

I don't think anyone mentioned whether the drought was man made or otherwise. The fact seems to be, according to two fairly well respected research institutes, that it was a factor in at least fanning the flames of the Syrian conflict. If you wish to discredit such research as leftist funded propaganda, you'll have to do a lot better than a throwaway comment.

Svejk, I'm delighted that my Telegraph link has enlightened you. :-)

[vetuste_ennemi]

"In what scientists say is one of the most detailed and strongest connections between violence and HUMAN-CAUSED climate change, researchers from Columbia University and the University of California Santa Barbara trace the effects of Syria's drought from the collapse of farming, to the migration of 1.5 million farmers to the cities, and then to poverty and civil unrest.".

I didn't read the post with insufficient care, did, I?

I do, however, concede that the respected academics may have been misreported.

[Zacs-Master]

I meant anyone on here. And I still don't see what difference it makes unless you want to spin the situation faster than a pulsar and turn it into some half baked political point scoring comment.

[Gromit]

Obama's first foreign policy speech was delivered at Cairo University in 2009 and called 'A New Beginning'. It was the greenlight for the Arab Spring which followed 18 months later. The Arab Spring was no accident. It followed Obama's blueprint and was a deliberate plan to target certain regimes (but not others) for regime change. Genuine concerns were exploited by US backed agitators in these countries, and the Governments were overthrown. But the policy had unforseen consequences, first in Egypt, where the new Government was actually more anti west than the previous one (and had to ve removed by military coup) and then Syria because of Russia's unwillingness to let an ally fall.

[Gromit]

Have tracked down the cited piece of 'research' by yhe University of California and it is here.

http://www.pnas.org/content/112/11/3241.full.pdf

I am not convinced. The drought study was actually the whole fertile crescent region, sweeping from Turkey, through Iraq, and Iran. Syria was on the perifery of the study and included just one weather station (out of 25 used) and the readings from that station showed virtually no changed from 'normal' rainfall. Trying to pin the Syrian conflict on the drought based on this study seems highly flawed. Almost as if a legitimate peice of research has been hijacked to distract from the political cause.

[ichkeria]

Gromit with the greatest respect, your talk of a 'super power conflict' is a load of old Charlottes :-) In case you hadn't noticed, Russia ceased to be a 'super power' years ago. Surely you aren't suggesting the CIA (which admittedly avowedly now does support a rebel faction) instigated the protests. There's more in Ms Church's climate change theory even if it's only part of the story

[Svejk]

/// Surely you aren't suggesting the CIA instigated the protests.///

As if, lol.

[Zacs-Master]

Two weather stations in Syria were used.

[agchristie]

Thanks for your contributions. Regarding Charlotte's mention of the real world and AOG's response:

//What does she know about the real world//

AOG - she has packed a lot in her life to the extent that she wrote an autobiography aged 14! Not only that but there was a sequel aged 21!

I think Charlotte tries so hard to be taken seriously but ends up receiving contempt and derision. Probably peaked far too early in her career. Consider this...

At age 15 she was criticised for remarks she made about the behaviour of people in the aftermath of the 11 September 2001 attacks. [30] At the Leveson Inquiry she stated that her comments were taken vastly out of context. [31] In a 2006 interview with Davina McCall,she agreed being diplomatic was "not in her nature". [32] In November 2011, Church testified before the Leveson Inquiry about the media intrusion into her personal life stating "I've been made a caricature for so long, and this person portrayed in the tabloids really isn't me. It's not the person I am, and it's had a massive impact on my career. As an artist, I find it hard to be taken seriously because my credibility has been blown to bits."

Now that IS the real world.....

[Gromit]

Zacs Master, the other weather data from Syria sjowed nosignificant drought at all.

// The authors say they have found a statistically significant drying at several stations in the area, marked by circles. However, in fact as they note in the text only 5 of 25 stations showed this "significant" drying and only one of these was in Syria. Moreover, when they say "significant" in this case, they are using a significance level of only 0.1. //

It looks to me as if what they have done is to use a minor drying trend in the wetter parts of Turkey, Iraq and Iran to make a completely spurious claim about the climate in Syria. //

[agchristie]

It is a fascinating theory that drought/climate change brought about the civil unrest.

Charlotte claimed on the programme that this was a 'big factor' in the cause. The links kindly provided by Zacs suggest it was 'in part' and 'a contributing factor' to the unrest but the authors stopped short of going further on the theory.

I think Charlotte may have somewhat placed a little more emphasis based on the actual evidence but has been unfairly panned in some quarters. The silence from the QT audience was probably stunned disbelief but how many of us were aware of the research?

In summary, lots of factors involved but perhaps not the primary cause but there again, Charlotte does not suggest it was.

[Gromit]

Because they eat unlevened bread throught the middle east, they lack Zinc in their diets which makes them irritable and start wars. The solution - Marmite.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/de-bonos-marmite-plan-for-peace-in-middle-yeast-1133338.html

[Khandro]

That was 16 years ago, I think we now need plan B

[Ric.ror]

Now your talking Gromit
I think I mentioned the marmite connection a couple of weeks ago

[agchristie]

Gromit // they lack Zinc in their diets which makes them irritable and start wars. The solution -Marmite.//

Now if Charlotte Church had suggested this your earlier description of her being 'bonkers' would have applied!

[Khandro]

As the Chinese now own Marmite, we should be mindful that they might remove the zinc as part of their plan to conquer the world.

[Tizzi24]

I agree with gromit, she@s nuts.

[agchristie]

Tizzi24 - do you mean generally or her views on this topic? If it is the latter have you read the evidence provided by Zacs which is what Charlotte referred to?

[Svejk]

Just because a university produces a, funding securing, report that chimes with leftist thinking doesn't make it a fact, ag. Quite the contrary.