Mother Accused Of Stabbing To Death Her 3 And 1 Year Old Daughters.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3325087/Pictured-Two-young-girls-stabbed-death-mother-Bradford-house.html

Two more little young lives cut short in this oh so cruel world of ours, RIP little Evelyn and Jasmine.

[viv41]

Why could she be mentally ill, she could just be evil, there's a lot of it about !!

[andy-hughes]

viv41 - //Why could she be mentally ill, she could just be evil, there's a lot of it about !! //

I don't believe that 'evil' people are sane and rational - the concept of being 'evil' cannot exist in a sane and rational mind.

[ummmm]

I suppose she could have woke up evil that day.

[andy-hughes]

ummmm - //I suppose she could have woke up evil that day. //

The additional tragedy is that we are probably never going to know.

[Barsel]

Did she just wake up mentally ill that day? Probably not this severe as this isn't possible, then she must have had a mental illness for sometime. So is it going to be a case of another one who slipped through the net?

[sunny-dave]

"sane people do not kill their children"

(or, by extension, "sane people don't do inexplicably awful things")


That's a convenient (and circular) argument used to let far too many people wriggle away from the consequences of their actions :

"No sane person could have done this"
"My client did this"
"Therefore my client is not fit to plead, on the grounds of mental illness"

I know nothing of this case - and people who speculate here on this woman's sanity/motives are wasting pixels - but a blanket assumption of insanity in this sort of case is just plain wrong.

[douglas9401]

Looks like 'let's just wait and see' is off the table then.

[andy-hughes]

sunny-dave - //I know nothing of this case - and people who speculate here on this woman's sanity/motives are wasting pixels - but a blanket assumption of insanity in this sort of case is just plain wrong. //

I don't think anyone is offering a 'blanket assumption' because no-one knows any facts at this early stage.

Simply debating possibilities does not equate with assumptions - blanket or otherwise.

[andy-hughes]

Barsel - //So is it going to be a case of another one who slipped through the net? //

Mentally ill people do not 'slip though' any nets.

Until any such illness manifests itself in identifiable behaviour, it is impossible to determine who is a sufferer, and who is not.

And in some cases, that behaviour can be buried beneath a veneer of 'sane' behaviour - Harold Shipman anyone?

[sunny-dave]

I was speaking generally, andy - certainly not pointing any fingers at you, or indeed anyone else.

I'm just disturbed by the increasing trend for mental illness to be used as a Get Out Of Jail Free Card in cases of extreme cruelty (or worse).

Depression and other mental illnesses are a ghastly scourge (I know, I've been there) - a kneejerk move to use them in every case like this is profoundly unhelpful and demeaning to sufferers/survivors of the illnesses.

[ummmm]

My aunty committed suicide, no one knew there was anything wrong!

People who suffer with mental health issues often do so very secretly.

I'm not suggesting that if shes mentally ill she should get a lesser sentence...

[ummmm]

Dave...is not a 'get out of jail' card...it's about where they are sent when they are convicted.

[retrocop]

//Mentally ill people do not 'slip though' any nets. //

I disagree. If someone uses long words and implies they are intelligent and bluff/deceive others in believing they know what they are talking about and then do some crazy act that was pre planned then they could have always been mentally unbalanced but "slipped through the net" of detection.

[viv41]

Agree wholeheartedly with your second para. at 11:51 dave.

I still maintain she could just be an evil person !

[ummmm]

Do you think she waited until they got to a certain age before she decided to murder them?

[retrocop]

ummm
who would know that. I was always told that mental illness is a very thin and easy line to cross from sanity to insanity like the click of a finger. Snap.

[dannyk13]

The stabbing occurred at a women's refuge so she was obviously having some sort of problem.

[andy-hughes]

sunny-dave - //I was speaking generally, andy - certainly not pointing any fingers at you, or indeed anyone else.

I'm just disturbed by the increasing trend for mental illness to be used as a Get Out Of Jail Free Card in cases of extreme cruelty (or worse).

Depression and other mental illnesses are a ghastly scourge (I know, I've been there) - a kneejerk move to use them in every case like this is profoundly unhelpful and demeaning to sufferers/survivors of the illnesses. //

I take your point, and took no personal reference from your observation - thank you.

I don't really believe that mental health is the legal smokescreen it used to be years ago - diagnosis and recognition of mental conditions is far more sophisticated than it used to be, but like you, I would be seriously put out if anyone used a defence that was not genuine in order to escape due retribution.

[anotheoldgit]

Mental illness, severe depression, and now 'very distraught' we have heard all these diagnoses were certain women murders are concerned.

But where male murderers of this kind are concerned, we see the descriptions monsters, evil, etc, should be hanged etc.

Why the differences?

Incidentally I notice the link is not the one I originally set, they have updated it since she failed to turn up to court, due to her being 'very distraught'.

[andy-hughes]

AOG - //Mental illness, severe depression, and now 'very distraught' we have heard all these diagnoses were certain women murders are concerned.

But where male murderers of this kind are concerned, we see the descriptions monsters, evil, etc, should be hanged etc.

Why the differences? //

Perception.

Because male murderers outweigh female murderers by a huge number, and often murder women in violent ways, it is easy to slide into the perception that men are potential 'monsters'.

Women on the other hand often murder abusive partners or attackers, and can be perceived (again a generalisation) as victims in their own crime.

The media have long assisted with such stereotyping.