If Our Border Officials Can't Do Their Job, Should We Now Send In The Troops?

[anotheoldgit]

/// But, in a bizarre intervention yesterday, a human rights activist said the two groups of stowaways should not be called illegal immigrants. ///

/// Nils Muiznieks, a Council of Europe commissioner, said such language was dehumanising. ///

What planet are these sort of people on? You could not make it up.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3506111/Pictured-moment-26-migrants-including-five-children-jammed-lorry-near-Dartford-Crossing.html

[Togo]

Until, of course the next lorry load is armed to the teeth.

[Gromit]

// Refugee from Syria or not, smuggling one's self into a country without proper documentation is an illegal act. //

Yep, that is exactly what I wrote.

There is no obligation for a refugee to claim asylum in the first safe country they arrive at. It is not in the Geneva Convention. (Sign by us pre-EU by the way). UK law states they can only be removed to a third country only if that third country wants them, and no one does.

[retrocop]

Soldiers don't carry guns when trying to control E-boli outbreaks.
Soldiers don't carry guns when driving Green Goddesses in Fire Brigade strikes
Soldiers don't carry guns when emptying rubbish bins during dustbin strikes

[AB Editor]

They're still probably not the right people for the job Retro :)

[retrocop]

The military have great expertise in searching vehicles thoroughly. They honed their skills in Northern Ireland and were looking for smaller items hidden in/on vehicles than a human body. The military are trained to man check points.!

[jackthehat]

So, we don't employ more Border guards, we send the troops to do the 'stop and searches'......then across the country and especially in the cities we get a raised 'threat level' to Crimson and deploy....erm....erm.....who, exactly to sort that out?

[Islay]

One may say Retrocop given the number of bombs going off in Northern Ireland that they were not that succesfull!

[mushroom25]

gromit, the geneva convention is to do with POWs.

currently it's the Dublin Convention that covers refugees and asylum claims. this does require asylum to be claimed in the first "safe" state reached.
http://www.ecre.org/topics/areas-of-work/protection-in-europe/10-dublin-regulation.html

[retrocop]

Islay
No you can't really say they were not that successful because you will never know how many bombs and explosive materials plus Armalites and ammunition were found in a load of these checks.

[anotheoldgit]

Gromit

/// There is no obligation for a refugee to claim asylum in the first safe country they arrive at. It is not in the Geneva
Convention. ///

*** Under the Dublin Regulation, an asylum seeker has to apply for asylum in the first EU country they entered, and if they cross borders to another country after being fingerprinted, they can be returned to the former. ***

[alavahalf]

This is just an observation that may possibly mean the goverment are already reacting to the possible influx of 'last chance immigrants' if we pull out of Europe.
Not sure if anyone else has been scanning the job and employment sites over the last year or so. But ever since we have heard that we may or may not be leaving Europe, there has been quite a number of vacancies appearing for Border Control- Marine Operatives. When I say quite a few I mean approx 100 in the past 3 weeks, based around the south coast. Whereas going back over the past year, I have not previously seen one other similar position advertised.

[vulcan42]

I don't understand why technology isn't used more in this situation. Every haulier who wants to enter the UK must have a carbon dioxide detector fitted to their vehicles wired to an alarm in the cab. When people are detected the vehicle is driven to a secured area and the stowaways removed, something else that should be removed is the fining of drivers. No troops or extra border guards needed and the cost of fitting detectors is nothing compared to being fined.

[AB Editor]

I'm not doubting their ability retro, but that maybe we could just use a few more border guards instead?

We're going to need them if the country for #brexit?

[Gromit]

Mushroom

The basis for UK law is the 1951 Refugee Convention (that is what I meant, I put Geneva instead of Refugee).

http://www.unhcr.org/pages/49da0e466.html

The Dublin III is an EU regulation. It states that the first country where the asylum seeker is fingerprinted, is responsible for their asylum application.

[anotheoldgit]

jackthehat

/// deploy....erm....erm.....who, exactly to sort that out? ///

I know we may be a little short of our armed services, but there is still plenty to go round.

If not we can always depend on the Territorial Army or those on reserve.

[Togo]

True, and we can appoint them without seeking permission from Europe.^^

[Gromit]

AOG,

We seem to have inadvertantly agreed. The first country to fingerprint them is responsible for their application. Not the first country they reach.

[retrocop]

JTH
This country's current security threat level is 'severe' meaning an attack highly probable. Second only to critical.
No one would argue that Paris and Brussels have suffered emergency situations with the loss of many lives in recent months.
Someone said yesterday that we were a lot safer because we don't have adjoining borders and the arms and explosives can't be smuggled through Europe to this country where awaiting jihadis can access them.
I think yesterday's fiasco proves our border is porous and that lorry could just as easily have contained half a ton of semtex and 500 Kalashnikovs.
If that was the case and did happen would anyone say we were not in an emergency situation if that lot was used in Paddington,Gatwick and other areas of the country particularly softer targets like power stations etc.
It is better to start looking now at emergency measures and prevent the 'highly probable' terror assessment.

[jackthehat]

Extra Border guards could have discovered yesterday's human cargo as they could a cache of arms or explosives....it wouldn't have needed any sort of military training.

[Gromit]

The simplest solution is to employ more border guards. Sending in the army is papering over the cracks.