Now Milliband Sticks The Knife In, Is Labour Really Dead Now?

[youngmafbog]

Really not looking good now.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3801712/Labour-power-time-1930s-David-Miliband-warns-Jeremy-Corbyn-prepares-elected-leader-second-time.html

[Gromit]

David who?

[douglas9401]

David Moribund, Gromit. The man who would be king.

[ichkeria]

He's only stating what other more distinguished Labour grandees have said.

The fact that he has also said it doesn't make it any more or less likely.

( Looks like both George Bushes might be voting for Clinton in November btw (!) )

[Gromit]

The Brexit vote was swayed to leave in Labour stronghold areas. The North, Newcastle, Manchester, Liverpool.

Official Labour policy was to stay but its core voters voted out. So who is out of touch with Labour voters? Miliband senior has the wrong policies for Labour.

Miliband is a Blairite and they seem unable to accept they they (and their policies) have lost the last two General Elections.

They are just offering more of the same, and the electorate don't want that.

[ichkeria]

Dire opinion poll ratings, esp in Scotland with next to no MPs and where the chief Tory is now being touted (admittedly ridiculously) as some sort of political messiah)
I suspect David didn't need to stretch his considerable brain too much to come to that conclusion.
In the 1980s Michael Foot spoke to packed meetings of adoring supporters and, well, the rest is history ..
Hard, unchanging, and cold, Jeremy Corbyn is the rock on which the Labour Party is foundered.

[Gromit]

ichkeria
Labour lost Scotland under Milipede's brother, not Corbyn. A bit disingenuous to blame Corbyn for all Labour's woes north of the border.

[youngmafbog]

True Milliband is a Blairite, but surely that is what got labour elected, not hard Marxist policies?

It is Middle England labourt need to appeal to, I would have thought many of them would still hold sympathy for David due to the way his brother stabbed him in the back?

[youngmafbog]

Scotland is a special case, more to do with 'independance' I would have thought.

[ichkeria]

Labour's poll ratings are worse now than they were at the time of the election, even in Scotland.
Corbyn's rating among voters is also worse than Ed's.

Of course, it's all Tony Blair's fault really :-)

[cassa333]

I've said this before and this probably won't be the last...

They should not be grandstanding to packed venues with adoring fans. They should be campaigning to those that don't agree with them. They should be trying to show those that sit on the other side or on the fence why they are right and how they will make a difference.

Getting all happy flappy with your supporters is just ego boosting. Get off the safe sofa and tour the areas and talk to the people who don't see you as any good.

That will bring them down to earth.

[youngmafbog]

Yes, well although it was joked he was Red Ed inreality he is pretty much a Tory next to Corbyn and his mates.

Marxism/Communism died out years ago when labour achieved its goal of not haveing down trodden workers. Workers now own their own houses, cars and have foreign holidays and also have apserations and form the base of 'Middle England'. Doesnt quite fit Corbyn's (or Momentums) view of the world.

[Gromit]

Ymb,
Blairism used to work, but it is totally discredited now. Blairism lost the elections in 2010 and 2015. Voters have seen through it and are not voting for it.

Whilst appealing to middle England used to be priority, the priority now must be not to lose anymore of its core voters. The North and Wales could easily go the way of Scotland if Labour don't start to appeal to them again. The 2020 election looks an impossible win for Labour. Now is the time to concentrate on repositioning the Party and deselecting disloyal ToryLite MPs who are in the wrong party.

[youngmafbog]

But without Middle England you are going nowhere.

Retreating to 1970's politics, also seen through by the public will loose you votes surely.

I get your point, but realligning must mean a new way forward not an old one. Blairite policies, as you say, are not the answer but they could easily be modified to bring people back. Perhaps they should look at hte UKIP manifesto or read The currant bun to find outt what voters want?

[ichkeria]

Yes moaning about "Blairism" is not the answer. Just as "Blairism" itself is not indeed.

Labour needs to look forward, not back. Jeremy Corbyn is an anachronism, but thus far he's been able to present himself as something new and exciting (how bored do you have to be to find JC exciting I wonder but that's another matter), or at last different. Because he IS different, no doubt about that.
He reminds me of the old sea captain played by Tom Baker in Blackadder III.
Who had the exciting and different idea of going to sea without a ship (!!)

[Gromit]

But winning middle England and losing the North and Wales is not a winning formula either.

My own area is (supposedly) solid Labour, but had one of the highest Brexit votes in England (62%). That disconnect between their core voters and the Party is dangerous for Labour.

[ichkeria]

It doesn't, to my mind, make any sense to fixate about "core voters".
No party does well when it does that, esp in a FPTP system. Labour's "traditional" voters are a declining breed as ymb correctly observes. If Labour does not broaden its appeal beyond the underprivileged, the exploited, and the middle class trendies flocking to Momentum, then even David M's, and Neil K's dire predictions are going to look optimistic.

[ToraToraTora]

Leave Jezza alone, despite the best efforts of his MPs Jezza has won the leadership twice and he's the Tories friend.

[sp1814]

Yes...Labour is dead.

There will only be the LibDems, Greens, Conservatives and UKIP.

Everyone who ever voted Labour before will have to switch their votes to another party.

A nail in the coffin of democracy.

[ichkeria]

Labour is not, of course, dead. And David Miliband is not saying it is. The party has a huge membership, at the moment, and is going to continue to have enough MPs for it to be the official opposition.
Any more than that though seems unlikely for the foreseeable future.

[Gromit]

// and is going to continue to have enough MPs for it to be the official opposition. //

Unless they set up a new party and all defect to that before they are deselected.