Soft Brexit Could Damage Your Health Warn Doctors

[lindapalmara]

What shocks me most is that no language/competence checks can be done to protect "Freedom of movement" yet doctors coming from America and Australia and America have to sit a written exam three hour exam.

"http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4074948/Soft-Brexit-damage-health-warn-doctors-Regulator-says-NHS-left-powerless-perform-checks-European-medics-UK-stays-single-market.html

Remember this

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2010/jun/16/daniel-ubani-gp-guilty-serious-misconduct

[dannyk13]

Who knows what 'soft Brexit' means?.We will have to wait and see.

[Gromit]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-4074948/Soft-Brexit-damage-health-warn-doctors-Regulator-says-NHS-left-powerless-perform-checks-European-medics-UK-stays-single-market.html

[Zacs-Master]

The Mail,article,seems to have been written by someone with no understanding of the situation. It contradicts itself and resorts to crystal ball gazing speculation so much that it could be a chapter from Alice thru the Looking Glass.

You'd have to be thick as a brick to believe that 'Brexit supporters will use the GMC's argument to bolster their case that British patients can be kept safe only with a complete break from the EU.'

[Gromit]

It's a bit of a confused argument and report.

It is suggesting an hard Brexit is the only way to keep bad doctors out. Which means they are saying we currently have bad foreign doctors because of EU rules. Which is patently not the case.
NHS employers, such as hospital trusts, have a duty to make sure their medical employees are competent and adequately qualified. They are not obligated by the EU to take sub-standard doctors.
As I say, confusing and deliberately misleading.

[lindapalmara]

Gromit. The GMC are saying that hospitals are not allowed to test any of these doctors yet there is this unlevel playing field where doctors wanting to come from outside the EU have to sit a written test and a half day practical assessment. A British Doctor applying for a job in, say, Australia, would have to do the same. Quite rightly so. However Brussels bans such testing for EU Medics.

As for Soft and hard Brexit. It is plain to me ( as one of these thick and uneducated people who voted Leave this odious group) that Hard Brexit is leave and soft Brexit Is stay, with nothing changing.

[dannyk13]

Linda, I don't think soft Brexit means stay, I think it means leaving but retaining certain connections. e.g free trade.

[ToraToraTora]

leaving aside brexit for now, you mean up to now we have to let any charlatan quack here to work no questions asked? Another piece of EU madness!

[TheChair]

"you mean up to now we have to let any charlatan quack here to work no questions asked?"
No.

[Zacs-Master]

the whole GMC argument revolves around a soft Brexit keeping the same lax checks in place. We don't even know what Brexit means let alone a soft one.

[youngmafbog]

Yes TTT, we put our own doctors and Nurses though the hoops but let any badly trained person in from another country.

[lindapalmara]

Anyway, I will have to leave you now. My Mother, who is on an End of Life plan is coming home from hospital this afternoon to continue her palliative care. I spent most of the day there yesterday and there were 3 junior doctors on the ward. One was Polish, one was from Asia and the other Australian. They were all absolutely excellent, especially George, the polish Doctor. But when I read this article today I realized that two off these doctors had had to be rigorously tested and the third one, instead of lovely George, could have been Daniel Ubani prescribing her controlled drugs.

[Gromit]

// but [we] let any badly trained person in from another country. //

Do you really believe that?

It is a Euro Myth and not true, as explained here.

https://blogs.ec.europa.eu/ECintheUK/the-eu-is-not-blocking-checks-on-doctors-qualifications/

[Zacs-Master]

Yep, some evidence of the checks here:
http://www.gmc-uk.org/doctors/registration_applications/24985.asp

http://www.gmc-uk.org/Facsheet___EEA___EC_Rights___DC2405.pdf_46051540.pdf

[Gromit]

// It is a myth that EU rules require the UK to employ European doctors and nurses without proof that their medical skills and English are up to scratch. This is not the case and never has been.
But the responsibility for remedying it lies with the UK authorities and employers. There is nothing in EU rules — agreed with the UK in the first place — which prevents them doing so. //

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/health/9027445/Brussels-will-welcome-a-stronger-safety-net.html

So the truth is that there is nothing in the EU rules preventing, checks, competency checks or other investigations into an EU employee.

[fiction-factory]

I assumed hospitals used a recruitment and selection process to appoint doctors but now I'm wondering whether they just have to take the ones they are told to take or whether they are so desperate they will take anyone

[cassa333]

Linda,

I hope your mothers time is not spent in pain and you are able to say your farewells.

[Peter Pedant]

Lindie You are being manipulated

At present the GMC cannot set competency tests on already qualified doctors who are EU nationals and EU trained - they have already been tested for competency by their national bodies and this has been the case since 1973

so it is not true to say they cannot test and this will affect patient safety

the relevant page is here
http://www.gmc-uk.org/doctors/registration_applications/acceptable_primary_medical_qualification.asp

which doesnt look like a schengen open door to me

The GMC cannot test language skills but the employer can

Britain is not the only regulator - other countries have them - of varying cost and efficiency - so if one foreign regulator is not doing its job is there an international association it could be taken up with ?
Why yes there is
http://www.gmc-uk.org/news/29293.asp?AcceptCookie=true

and the head is one Niall Dickson - hold it isnt he chief exec also of the GMC here in dear old blighty in London ? yes he is
busy saying one thing in one place and another to the MPs in westminster

isnt he a naughty boy ! ?

[Peter Pedant]

// I'm wondering whether they just have to take the ones they are told to take or//

no there is thing called selection - and interviews

come on everyone - brains ON !

[lindapalmara]

Thank you Cassa. She is not now coming home till tomorrow because they have found that her oxygen levels are low and they are delivering oxygen tomorrow. All I want is a painless death for her and it has been upsetting to see her in such pain this last few days. The NHS however have been wonderful.

[Mamyalynne]

Thinking of you Linda I know it's very difficult but enjoy the time left you have together.x