Quizzes & Puzzles0 min ago
What Is Other Ab Members Opinion?
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I am not commenting, just want others views.
I am not commenting, just want others views.
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What on Earth has bananas to do with Brexit ? Are folk supposed to be held responsible for every pre-Brexit rumour ? I say again, leaver misinformation is difficult to find. At best one might find evidence that the occasional idiot didn't get with the programme and stick with the official arguments.
Eddie, //United we stand divided we fall.//
Alarmist nonsense from you again! There are around 200 countries in the world, a meagre 29 of which belong to the EU. Discounting Third World countries, that leaves a considerable number that manage to survive quite nicely outside the EU – and
trade with the EU – and there’s no reason we can’t do the same. Get a grip!
Alarmist nonsense from you again! There are around 200 countries in the world, a meagre 29 of which belong to the EU. Discounting Third World countries, that leaves a considerable number that manage to survive quite nicely outside the EU – and
trade with the EU – and there’s no reason we can’t do the same. Get a grip!
//Why did you vote to remain in the EU? //
a) Fundamentally, the continent faces a choice about whether it goes back to the "state-of-nature" politics of the late nineteenth/early twentieth century or whether they collaborate to make something bigger than any individual member. I find the latter more appealing, because the former doesn't work particularly well over the long term and is not sustainable. Notice, by the way, that I don't think doing it the second way has to - or needs to be - perfect. It just needs to be better than what we were doing 100-150 years ago. On balance, I think European politics is better for all concerned than it was then.
b) I felt that if we voted leave, then there was too high a chance the government would ignore the safer options of EEA membership and instead pick a fight with 26 other countries with, essentially, nothing whatsoever to negotiate with. That is, in my opinion, what has happened. It won't end up being good for the UK, but in the long run we'll survive it in a way that we wouldn't if the vote was reversed now (my argument above).
a) Fundamentally, the continent faces a choice about whether it goes back to the "state-of-nature" politics of the late nineteenth/early twentieth century or whether they collaborate to make something bigger than any individual member. I find the latter more appealing, because the former doesn't work particularly well over the long term and is not sustainable. Notice, by the way, that I don't think doing it the second way has to - or needs to be - perfect. It just needs to be better than what we were doing 100-150 years ago. On balance, I think European politics is better for all concerned than it was then.
b) I felt that if we voted leave, then there was too high a chance the government would ignore the safer options of EEA membership and instead pick a fight with 26 other countries with, essentially, nothing whatsoever to negotiate with. That is, in my opinion, what has happened. It won't end up being good for the UK, but in the long run we'll survive it in a way that we wouldn't if the vote was reversed now (my argument above).
Yes we had influence, the UK would be taking it's turn as head of the EU this year. We are / were one of the largest economies in the EU and one of the most influential. We most definitely will not have any influence once we are out!
Even with a 'Full Hard Brexit' the EU will still have a profound influence on our economy, trade, exports and imports.
Remember we have to import over 50% of all our food, most of it from the EU, that % can only get higher, but we will have no input / influence whatsoever .
Even with a 'Full Hard Brexit' the EU will still have a profound influence on our economy, trade, exports and imports.
Remember we have to import over 50% of all our food, most of it from the EU, that % can only get higher, but we will have no input / influence whatsoever .
We did certainly have some influence in the EU - we were able to secure ourselves enormous, unique rebates on our membership costs and even persuade other countries like France to subsidise them. Not a single other country has ever managed to secure this, and it applies only to Great Britain. If that's not a marker of influence I don't know what is.
Also it is simply a fact that the Council of Europe is one of the main places where modern diplomacy in Europe is done. People seem to blithely assume that everyone will fall over to learn and meet the UK's interests now that we have seceded from it. They won't. Diplomatically speaking, the UK's power will diminish.
But we are rehashing the referendum argument. It's all irrelevant now. Leave won and it doesn't particularly matter how fairly or by how much. It is probably theoretically possible via some legal gymnastics to either indefinitely delay Brexit or to stop it happening altogether, but this would be an absolutely catastrophic thing to do in just about every possible sense. We should now be trying to make the best of it.
But we are rehashing the referendum argument. It's all irrelevant now. Leave won and it doesn't particularly matter how fairly or by how much. It is probably theoretically possible via some legal gymnastics to either indefinitely delay Brexit or to stop it happening altogether, but this would be an absolutely catastrophic thing to do in just about every possible sense. We should now be trying to make the best of it.
Countries can cooperate without being one unit. No one picks a fight simply for refusing to keep the unreasonable impositions that forced leaving in the first place. However refusing to agree a decent deal unless one accepts the unreasonable impostitions could be considered as spoiling for a fight. Luckily, with a whole world to trade with, one can ignore such provocations.
There really is no way of telling how many leave voters changed their minds since (though I expect the proportion is vanishingly small), and it's also irrelevant. Voting matters, and should matter - if there is anyone who voted Leave as a "protest" or a "laugh" and now regrets their decision, they will need to face the consequences like an adult.
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