The Noes Have It

[vetuste_ennemi]

..what now? May talks Let's find out?

[Jackdaw33]

All I can say is 'What a joyous morn'. May and her pseudo-deal completely shafted.

[naomi24]

//I fear that some Brexit supporters are too wedded to the idea that the EU is an adversary to be willing to ever compromise. //

I don't see how there can be compromise on the concept of 'Leave'. Leave means Leave.

[jim360]

Would you agree, at least, that "Leave" refers to the end state of affairs, rather than the journey to get there?

[naomi24]

Of course. Strange question.

[spathiphyllum]

Naomi, Brexit means Brexit lm(panties)o. Yeah but how dough??

The different concepts of leave, would be how and with what deals, or no deals at all.

"the journey is the destination"

-
Buddha

[jim360]

Sorry for asking the question, then -- It probably should have been obvious, but I hope you'll appreciate that after May's whole "Brexit means Brexit" period, it seemed worth checking.

The main problem at the moment, in parliament at least, is that there is a serious argument on how, and when, to get to the final state of affairs. Hard Brexiters in Parliament want to get there *now* (or, at least, on March 29th). If they abandoned this concept of leaving *now*, would it make things easier to resolve, or would this also be a step too far, in your view?

[spathiphyllum]

it may relieve some pressure, so you'd assume it would make it easier. But then things get put in a (what seems like) never ending pipeline , so i mean.. who knows?

It's took us almost 3 years to go.. No where.

[naomi24]

Jim, //I hope you'll appreciate that after May's whole "Brexit means Brexit" period//

No I don't appreciate it because May's journey is a lie. Her 'Brexit means Brexit' doesn't mean Brexit .... and never did.

[jim360]

At the time, I think some people believed her and took her seriously.

[Bigbad]

“May and her pseudo-deal completely shafted.”
They were, Jackdaw, but I think it’ll just lead to us being sold even further down the river.

How can someone so weak also be so thick skinned?

I thought Corbyn got very over excited and megalomaniacal towards the end of his “no confidence” speech.

[naomi24]

Bigbad, I thought that too. In his eagerness to appear 'tough' he lost sight of the reality of it.

[jim360]

Who wants to lead the UK into what is, or what is increasingly appearing to be, a huge self-inflicted wound? That's the reason that no-one is seriously challenging May, or why Corbyn has waited and waited to call a Vote of No Confidence, and why despite all that has happened he's going to lose it.

[naomi24]

I think we're all aware that no one wants to take up the mantle, Jim.

[jim360]

Hard not to be, but it probably provides at least a partial answer to why May herself is so "thick-skinned". Partly her genuine stubbornness and inability to see reality, but partly her opponents' refusals to sharpen their knives.

[gulliver1]

The Conservative rats who abandoned ship last night , will climb aboard again tonight to support Mrs may, because they are frightend of losing their seats.

[spathiphyllum]

Thats the issue with the gov. More concerned about their personal lifes and situation than that of the nation. Grim.

[Old_Geezer]

The journey is also important. One doesn't go from Exeter to London via Swansea and Glasgow; and the destination doesn't change to Dublin, or worse back to the starting point, mid-journey. We have the route agreed, it has an arrival time in March. We don't need abandonments and delays discussed, we merely have to continue. If the EU wants to surprise everyone and start being reasonable, now's the time, but I'm not holding my breath.

[Bigbad]

Yes, I think a lot of them are more concerned for their own careers.
Most notably the two who campaigned enthusiastically for Brexit, but wanted to accept the deal:
Leadsom and Gove.

[Old_Geezer]

What sort of thought is it to try to combine slinging out an unacceptable deal for our nation, with voting themselves out of power; such that the moral Conservative MPs can be likened to rats climbing aboard ? Both voting decisions are simply common sense.

[Old_Geezer]

Clearly anyone who voted for the deal, and have claimed in the past to want to leave the EU, must have changed their mind. They should be reminded of their duty to implement the result of the referendum.