ChatterBank9 mins ago
Wuhan Social Distancing
Wuhan lifts social distancing measures after 3 days with no newly recorded cases.
Will the UK follow suit if we have 3 days no new cases?
Will the UK follow suit if we have 3 days no new cases?
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Ich, there was a cover-up
https:/
Bethany (the author) is one of the best commentators covering China and especially China-US relations at the moment.
The hard-right Trumpsters criticise her for being a voice of the Communist Party of China (CPC); meanwhile the CPC has withdrawn her visa for travel to China.
Upsetting both extreme wings is probably a sign of balance. Personally, I think she gives good insights into what is really going on there.
I should add that her insights match the experience of my many friends in the region, who are sending messages each day asking how things are in Europe, and offering advice on how to act in these difficult times.
https:/
Bethany (the author) is one of the best commentators covering China and especially China-US relations at the moment.
The hard-right Trumpsters criticise her for being a voice of the Communist Party of China (CPC); meanwhile the CPC has withdrawn her visa for travel to China.
Upsetting both extreme wings is probably a sign of balance. Personally, I think she gives good insights into what is really going on there.
I should add that her insights match the experience of my many friends in the region, who are sending messages each day asking how things are in Europe, and offering advice on how to act in these difficult times.
I think what they shoes is that certain authorities may have tried to cover it up, but failed.
Like I say, the news of a
“new disease” was released by sources in December.
I doubt if any government in the world could say it acted “soon enough”
But some of China’s neighbours did act swiftly, which might explain why they as well as China are now seeing an easing of the situation, heaving come nowhere near the doomsday scenarios some predict elsewhere
Not sure that’s anyone’s fault: no one likes to panic unnecessarily. And the west is unused to such things.
Like I say, the news of a
“new disease” was released by sources in December.
I doubt if any government in the world could say it acted “soon enough”
But some of China’s neighbours did act swiftly, which might explain why they as well as China are now seeing an easing of the situation, heaving come nowhere near the doomsday scenarios some predict elsewhere
Not sure that’s anyone’s fault: no one likes to panic unnecessarily. And the west is unused to such things.
I think it was not so much the speed of reaction, as the manner.
Both (South) Korea and Japan had experience ofthe SARS outbreak in 2003.
They tested widely, and isolated those found to be infected.
It was effective. Growth rates of the infection in both countries are low, compared the rates in Europe.
Europe and espeicially the United States were slow to test, so we don't really know where the centres of infection are located.
That means we are acting blind.
Both (South) Korea and Japan had experience ofthe SARS outbreak in 2003.
They tested widely, and isolated those found to be infected.
It was effective. Growth rates of the infection in both countries are low, compared the rates in Europe.
Europe and espeicially the United States were slow to test, so we don't really know where the centres of infection are located.
That means we are acting blind.
Spicerack
The WHO is trying to pacify China. China wants to set up a rival organisation to WHO, and WHO is desperately seeking to avoid antagonising China.
As a result, WHO advice relating to China can be a bit suspect. If you look at their announcements, they have never been critical of China, and always reproduced China official statistics, with no comment that the data might have been manipulated.
Something I massively regret.
WHO should be politically independent, but they have allowed politics to influence their advice, unfortunately.
The WHO is trying to pacify China. China wants to set up a rival organisation to WHO, and WHO is desperately seeking to avoid antagonising China.
As a result, WHO advice relating to China can be a bit suspect. If you look at their announcements, they have never been critical of China, and always reproduced China official statistics, with no comment that the data might have been manipulated.
Something I massively regret.
WHO should be politically independent, but they have allowed politics to influence their advice, unfortunately.
Ich://I think what they shoes is that certain authorities may have tried to cover it up, but failed.//
I think this is the point.
Transparency over this has become something of a test of the strength of democracies. And lack of transparency has meant a greater impact in both health terms and in terms of hit to the economy.
Both the US and China covered it up in the early stages – and Iran did the same. China's authoritarian regime used tools that all democracies shy away from as they sought to control spread of the virus.
Korea and Japan were more transparent. They used public awareness campaigns; testing and other techniques to manage spread.
Italy was unaware of the scale of spread in Lombardy, so was caught somewhat unawares.
Germany had time to react,and did so, with social isolation; fiscal measures to delay spread and support for workers.
UK acted too late.
US is a total mess due to complete mis-management.
The countries who managed the illness well, have governments that take responsibility and sho strong leadership.
Countries that lack decisive leadership, or ignore the science are suffering.
Japan, Korea,
I think this is the point.
Transparency over this has become something of a test of the strength of democracies. And lack of transparency has meant a greater impact in both health terms and in terms of hit to the economy.
Both the US and China covered it up in the early stages – and Iran did the same. China's authoritarian regime used tools that all democracies shy away from as they sought to control spread of the virus.
Korea and Japan were more transparent. They used public awareness campaigns; testing and other techniques to manage spread.
Italy was unaware of the scale of spread in Lombardy, so was caught somewhat unawares.
Germany had time to react,and did so, with social isolation; fiscal measures to delay spread and support for workers.
UK acted too late.
US is a total mess due to complete mis-management.
The countries who managed the illness well, have governments that take responsibility and sho strong leadership.
Countries that lack decisive leadership, or ignore the science are suffering.
Japan, Korea,
Hi Canary
I tried very hard to avoid politicising this. It's too important to polarise the debate by identifying with this or that political grouping.
If you want to do that, of course it is up to you.
Experience on this site (and others) shows that trying to score cheap political shots tend to reduce the argument to name-calling or other insults, and focus the debate on personal attacks, rather than understanding the issues.
Speaking personally, I took a long rest from this site because of precisely that behaviour. Having returned temporarily, I see many of the less divisive voices have left in the interim.
I wonder if that was because of the behaviour of some other members?
I tried very hard to avoid politicising this. It's too important to polarise the debate by identifying with this or that political grouping.
If you want to do that, of course it is up to you.
Experience on this site (and others) shows that trying to score cheap political shots tend to reduce the argument to name-calling or other insults, and focus the debate on personal attacks, rather than understanding the issues.
Speaking personally, I took a long rest from this site because of precisely that behaviour. Having returned temporarily, I see many of the less divisive voices have left in the interim.
I wonder if that was because of the behaviour of some other members?
Tamborine, I have not seen any distinction in the statistics between north and south, they are two areas of the same country and all I have seen is figures for the whole - can you give us a link that divides the figures into areas ? See https:/
o god this is a troll thread - how awful for everyone
and there was I thinking rationalist was er rational
oh well
no new cases after 3 days
no is the answer ( will we relax restrictions after 3 d)
it takes twenty days to DDDDIIIIIEE ! and so there is a lag of 2o d for every death - the pt was infected 20 d ago
the time to infection is 5 d but the wobble on that is large
2 to 20 d - time to temp and cough
so as ever we have to wait and see
be careful about following any advice on this thread
it may seriously damage your health !
and there was I thinking rationalist was er rational
oh well
no new cases after 3 days
no is the answer ( will we relax restrictions after 3 d)
it takes twenty days to DDDDIIIIIEE ! and so there is a lag of 2o d for every death - the pt was infected 20 d ago
the time to infection is 5 d but the wobble on that is large
2 to 20 d - time to temp and cough
so as ever we have to wait and see
be careful about following any advice on this thread
it may seriously damage your health !
// China's authoritarian regime used tools that all democracies shy away from as they sought to control spread of the virus.//
aargh this is complete rubbish and contradicted by the simplest facts. The chinese used tools that are seen in other countries and failed. They tried to suppress the reports of the virus and then did absolutely nothing to control the spread because they had denied it existed
the point of suppression was to ignore the problem and so it went out of control
there is no evidence at all that after they punished the doctor for reporting it that there wer any control measures at all
( otherwise why punish hiim if he is right and they are acting on it) jesus
aargh this is complete rubbish and contradicted by the simplest facts. The chinese used tools that are seen in other countries and failed. They tried to suppress the reports of the virus and then did absolutely nothing to control the spread because they had denied it existed
the point of suppression was to ignore the problem and so it went out of control
there is no evidence at all that after they punished the doctor for reporting it that there wer any control measures at all
( otherwise why punish hiim if he is right and they are acting on it) jesus
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