'Racist' Milwall Fans - Your View?

[andy-hughes]

There has been controversy about the reaction to players 'taking the knee' at a weekend game, where Milwall fans were heard to boo the players involved.

https://www.derbytelegraph.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/fa-launch-probe-after-millwall-4774697

It appears the FA are investigating the potential for action against the club for the 'racsist actions' of its fans.

Personally, I don't believe that showing your disapproval of an act of support for a social campaign - or a political organisation, depending on your viewpoint, equates to either not supporting that campain / organisation, or to actively advising your support of an opposite point of view.

Put simply, I don't believe that booing 'taking the knee' makes anyone a racist.

It's an assumption that has no basis in reason, and to me, it shows people being far too keen to look at a negative attitude to one behaviour, and ascribe it possessing a negative attitude to another, with no viable connection.

I am not a football fan, and I wouldn't ever boo anyone, or any action in public, but I do strongly dislike the pointless OTT woke-ism and self-righteousness of 'taking the knee' and I believe it has no place in our sports arenas, but if anyone were to accuse me of being a racist for expressing that view, we would be having serious words.

What are your views?

[Theland]

If your local supermarket vowed to fight racism for customers and staff and decided to ''politely request'' that as a mark of respect and solidarity, anti discrimination, inclusiveness and equality, everybody entering and leaving should take the knee, bow to picture of Nelson Malndela, and wave to a picture post of Black Lives Matter, would you join in, as everybody in front of you seem to be?

[Atheist]

Theland; get a grip. Have you ever seen anyone behaving as you describe?

[webbo3]

No, Ive stopped buying Ben and Jerrys and Yorkshire tea because of their support for BLM.

[Theland]

Hmmmm. Just got up - thinking .....................

[Ellipsis]

When you find yourself sympathising with Millwall fans, rather than an investigation into their behaviour, it's time to take stock.

Picture yourself at the game. It's just before kick-off. The players take the knee. The Millwall fans start booing. Do you join in? If not, what stops you?

[royfromaus]

Millwall Football club
The eyes of the world are on this football club tonight -your club- and they want us to fail



?
Does it?
Does Answerbank?

[webbo3]

ellipsis @ 19:13
\\When you find yourself sympathising with Millwall fans, rather than an investigation into their behaviour, it's time to take stock.

Picture yourself at the game. It's just before kick-off. The players take the knee. The Millwall fans start booing. Do you join in? If not, what stops you?//


lets turn this around, the company you work for insists that all employees take the knee at the start of every day in solidarity with BLM, the question is do you refuse. ? if so why?

[Mozz71]

My word Theland, I thought you spoke some claptrap on the religion and spirituality page, but you've outdone yourself there fella.

15 minutes to kick off, and for anyone who has it, the match is on Sky Sports Main Event.

[Mozz71]

Webbp, there's a huge difference between being forced to do it by an employer and watch other people do it voluntarily.

[andy-hughes]

Trevor - // Aside from the little childish snipe at me, are you saying then that if the fans don't boo the linking arms thing, den day isn't racisisists? Jeez, I thought you were beyond parody. Sad face. //

First of all, it wasn't a 'childish little snipe', I don't do those, it was a full-on scoff at the point you made, because I thought it was ridiculous.

As for saying that the 'linking arms' thing isn;t racist - I am not saying that at all, primarily because I have no idea what you are talking about, not being a football fan, the behaviours of fans, and the potential meanings of those beaviours, is something I know nothing about whatsoever, so I can't offer a comment one way or the other.

[Mozz71]

Nothing but cheers and applause at The Den tonight, for both the banner and knee taking.

[andy-hughes]

Theland - // If your local supermarket vowed to fight racism for customers and staff and decided to ''politely request'' that as a mark of respect and solidarity, anti discrimination, inclusiveness and equality, everybody entering and leaving should take the knee, bow to picture of Nelson Malndela, and wave to a picture post of Black Lives Matter, would you join in, as everybody in front of you seem to be? //

I know you have a vivid imagination, but that's far out even for you!

What on earth that bizarre scenario has to do with what we are discussing, I have no idea at all - if you care to make some level of comparison, feel free, it completely eludes me.

[Mamyalynne]

Good to hear Mozz.

[andy-hughes]

Ellipsis - // When you find yourself sympathising with Millwall fans, rather than an investigation into their behaviour, it's time to take stock. //

My own view, as my OP expressed, has nothing to do with 'sympathising with Milwall fans whatsoever.

My point is about the willingness to jump to a conclusion based on the utterly irrational premise that booing 'taking the knee' makes anyone doing so a racist.

The circumstances are irrelavent, it's the attitude of peoples' reactions that I am concerned with.

[andy-hughes]

Ellipsis - // Picture yourself at the game. It's just before kick-off. The players take the knee. The Millwall fans start booing. Do you join in? If not, what stops you? //

No I don;t join in, and what stops me is my aversion to mob behaviour.

I don't do booing, i think it's uncouth.

[andy-hughes]

webbo3 - // lets turn this around, the company you work for insists that all employees take the knee at the start of every day in solidarity with BLM, the question is do you refuse. ? if so why? //

I would refuse, because I would never let my employer dictate my social concience, or whether or not I choose to express it in public or not, and what, if any, that form of expression would take.

I worked for BT and when call centres were first set up, we got the beginnings of American style 'team building' coming in, with its attendent stupidity and attitudes that are entirely American, and compertely un-British.

I was never a member of CC staff, but had I been, and the manager had told me that the next day, everyone was wearing red as a 'team building' symbol, i would have made a point of dressing in green because a) I am old enough to dress myself, and don't take instructions from anyone about it, and b) my expressions of team building do not stretch to playing silly American games as though I was back in nursery.

[Mozz71]

You'd be no fun at a panto Andy.

[Ellipsis]

Andy, you have stated you knoe nothing about football, so possibly you you know nothing about Millwall fans and their reputation. If you did, you may well jump to conclusions about what lay behind the boos.

But as the story you linked to in the OP shows, the FA has not jumped to conclusions. They've launched an investigation, which is what is to be expected no matter which football club's fans were booing.

It's not clear why you think the FA already knows what their investigation will conclude. It seems to me that it's you that's jumping to conclusions, not them.

[royfromaus]

If there were any boo's then the cheering drowned them out...looks like the Millwall fans have made andy the victor on this occasion.

[Theland]

Some p!Ayers taking the knee must do so as they believe that they are doing some good, others will kneel just to go along with it.
Some racist fans will boo because they are racists, some wil boo as they believe the kneelers are racists, the accusers of white privilege,, and others .................