ChatterBank9 mins ago
Lia Thomas - Again. Are Sports Bodies Tying Themselves In Knots In Not Wanting To Offend The Tg Minority?
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NCAA Ranking as a man - 554th.
NCAA Ranking as a 'woman' - 1st.
'She' beat Emma Weyant, a silver medalist in Tokyo, by 1.75 seconds, and if the report I read at the weekend is true, 'she' appeared to be holding-back, presumably to avoid the gap being even greater as it would make the absurdity of the situation even more absurd.
The gold in Tokyo was won by 0.68 seconds ahead of Weyant, so if Thomas had gone to the Olympics, 'she' would most likely be the Olympic champion.
Lia Thomas is taking the place of a proper woman.
Sharon Davis has commented:
"She has greater upper-body strength and significantly more muscle mass than a woman of the same weight and height. She has a greater lung capacity, better VO2 uptake, different bone density, she is nearly 6ft 4in tall and has large hands and feet that act like paddles."
And a teammate has commented:
"...that they feel ‘awkward’ sharing a locker room with her because ‘Lia still has male body parts [by which I take they mean a penis] and is still attracted to women".
Why are sporting bodies allowing this absurdity to continue at the expense of women athletes?
NCAA Ranking as a man - 554th.
NCAA Ranking as a 'woman' - 1st.
'She' beat Emma Weyant, a silver medalist in Tokyo, by 1.75 seconds, and if the report I read at the weekend is true, 'she' appeared to be holding-back, presumably to avoid the gap being even greater as it would make the absurdity of the situation even more absurd.
The gold in Tokyo was won by 0.68 seconds ahead of Weyant, so if Thomas had gone to the Olympics, 'she' would most likely be the Olympic champion.
Lia Thomas is taking the place of a proper woman.
Sharon Davis has commented:
"She has greater upper-body strength and significantly more muscle mass than a woman of the same weight and height. She has a greater lung capacity, better VO2 uptake, different bone density, she is nearly 6ft 4in tall and has large hands and feet that act like paddles."
And a teammate has commented:
"...that they feel ‘awkward’ sharing a locker room with her because ‘Lia still has male body parts [by which I take they mean a penis] and is still attracted to women".
Why are sporting bodies allowing this absurdity to continue at the expense of women athletes?
Answers
I do not even know where to start with this. Naomi is doing brilliantly at stating that women are women (I am one myself)- that this can possibly be considered controversia
21:33 Wed 23rd Mar 2022
Gender dysphoria is rare- and in those cases, an operation might be helpful... but wouldn't require "validation" from others. The majority of trans people have no physical adjustments whatsoever.
I am currently looking after 4 boys (late teens, early 20s) who have started a transition process, changed their minds, and been left to it.
I am currently looking after 4 boys (late teens, early 20s) who have started a transition process, changed their minds, and been left to it.
I like women, they are different to men, nice to touch. Women unlike men have a layer of fat under their skin , makes them nice and sensuous. Men are muscular and their feel is different.
I accept there are people who can't accept their sex, must be a
problem for them.
Near me is a young man late twenties who has gone the full surgical procedure. Name changed from Sam to Samantha ( made that up)
Always seemed an odd character. Whilst I was at school there was a young chap who had effeminate inclinations, went on to be gay. No problems but, why is it, that certain gay men can be spotted in the most part immediately, Graham Norton and the like.
I was once asked if I would like to be a woman for a day, yes I said. I would love to go to a disco and dance round my handbag.
I have two daughters and three granddaughters , the thoughts of them sharing changing rooms with a man is abhorrent.
I accept there are people who can't accept their sex, must be a
problem for them.
Near me is a young man late twenties who has gone the full surgical procedure. Name changed from Sam to Samantha ( made that up)
Always seemed an odd character. Whilst I was at school there was a young chap who had effeminate inclinations, went on to be gay. No problems but, why is it, that certain gay men can be spotted in the most part immediately, Graham Norton and the like.
I was once asked if I would like to be a woman for a day, yes I said. I would love to go to a disco and dance round my handbag.
I have two daughters and three granddaughters , the thoughts of them sharing changing rooms with a man is abhorrent.
Please - an answer to a very simple question (hopefully from Jim, but I can’t see that happening).
Is it fair on sportswomen to complete against men who are identifying as female?
The answer is, of course, no it’s not, and it’s absurd to suggest it is, but I’m really interested in hearing from the likes of Jim.
Is it fair on sportswomen to complete against men who are identifying as female?
The answer is, of course, no it’s not, and it’s absurd to suggest it is, but I’m really interested in hearing from the likes of Jim.
//Is it fair on sportswomen to complete against men who are identifying as female?//
I’ve really said all I can, but of course it’s not fair.
This bloke is a mediocre male swimmer. But when he races against women he beats the Olympic silver medallist. That says it all. Yes, he’ll get beaten by some women because, on the face of it, it seems he’s not particularly good at it – certainly not world class. That’s not a valid argument to allow him into women’s events; if it was, all mediocre men should be allowed to compete against women. But he’ll get a lot more medals and cups when racing against women than he ever will when racing against men and that’s the bottom line. It is utterly unfair to women, there is no valid argument to allow him to compete against them and that’s that. Everything else is just “noise”.
I’m standing by, waiting to be “cancelled.”
I’ve really said all I can, but of course it’s not fair.
This bloke is a mediocre male swimmer. But when he races against women he beats the Olympic silver medallist. That says it all. Yes, he’ll get beaten by some women because, on the face of it, it seems he’s not particularly good at it – certainly not world class. That’s not a valid argument to allow him into women’s events; if it was, all mediocre men should be allowed to compete against women. But he’ll get a lot more medals and cups when racing against women than he ever will when racing against men and that’s the bottom line. It is utterly unfair to women, there is no valid argument to allow him to compete against them and that’s that. Everything else is just “noise”.
I’m standing by, waiting to be “cancelled.”
-- answer removed --
NJ- ////Is it fair on sportswomen to complete against men who are identifying as female?//
I’ve really said all I can, but of course it’s not fair.//
I agree completely within a sporting context, which is why I suggested that (albeit rather shot down) they should only be able to compete against other trans athletes.
DD- //...but I’m really interested in hearing from the likes of Jim.//
If you only want to hear from people who agree with you, you probably should stay off social media.
I’ve really said all I can, but of course it’s not fair.//
I agree completely within a sporting context, which is why I suggested that (albeit rather shot down) they should only be able to compete against other trans athletes.
DD- //...but I’m really interested in hearing from the likes of Jim.//
If you only want to hear from people who agree with you, you probably should stay off social media.
Just re the "popular" change in language.
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I suppose, in a sense, it's nice to know that people care enough about my opinion that they're still asking about it after several days. I had other things to do, and in any case it can hardly hurt to think quietly for a bit rather than reply on demand, especially on such a sensitive topic.
Having said that:
// Is it fair for a man identifying as a woman, who has had all the benefits of having gone through puberty and become a fully grown man with all the physical advantages that brings, to compete against proper women? //
I've already answered this question, at least implicitly. For example, my post at about 7.30pm last Tuesday, which concluded by saying, in effect, that the integrity of women's sport is more important to me than the right of trans women to participate, which wouldn't make sense if I didn't agree that male puberty conferred some innate advantages, absent considerations like extensive hormone treatment. Or my comment at 11.15am on Wednesday, making the same basic point; and again at 7.50pm that same evening:
//...because sports links to biology then trans women would have to accept certain limits on their ability to participate in sport. //
I only wish to add that I agree with what rowanwitch wrote earlier: "it must be possible to develop a system based on biometrics ... [so that] a trans female can compete with natural women without gaining an advantage." If that turns out to be *im*possible, then fair enough, that's an end to the matter; but we should adopt as far as possible a data-driven approach.
And it doesn't undermine my other basic point, which is that the fact of Lia Thomas's gender identity is a separate matter from the question of whether she should be allowed, or not, to participate in women's sport. It's a shame that the two are often conflated.
Having said that:
// Is it fair for a man identifying as a woman, who has had all the benefits of having gone through puberty and become a fully grown man with all the physical advantages that brings, to compete against proper women? //
I've already answered this question, at least implicitly. For example, my post at about 7.30pm last Tuesday, which concluded by saying, in effect, that the integrity of women's sport is more important to me than the right of trans women to participate, which wouldn't make sense if I didn't agree that male puberty conferred some innate advantages, absent considerations like extensive hormone treatment. Or my comment at 11.15am on Wednesday, making the same basic point; and again at 7.50pm that same evening:
//...because sports links to biology then trans women would have to accept certain limits on their ability to participate in sport. //
I only wish to add that I agree with what rowanwitch wrote earlier: "it must be possible to develop a system based on biometrics ... [so that] a trans female can compete with natural women without gaining an advantage." If that turns out to be *im*possible, then fair enough, that's an end to the matter; but we should adopt as far as possible a data-driven approach.
And it doesn't undermine my other basic point, which is that the fact of Lia Thomas's gender identity is a separate matter from the question of whether she should be allowed, or not, to participate in women's sport. It's a shame that the two are often conflated.
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