Brexit

[gulliver1]

Boris will go down in History as the P/M who
.............Didn't Get Brexit Done just left the UK in a state of Chaos.
What a shambles you have caused Boris. Go now and let the Country start repairing the Damage you have done.

[New Judge]

//I'm puzzled by your saying, 'What follows is unimportant'. What if the fragile peace in NI collapses and the bombings start again?//

So you're suggesting that the UK must remain in the EU in order to preserve peace in NI? I don't think so. Nobody other than the EU wants a hard border in NI. The UK doesn't want it; Ireland doesn't want it. Only their EU masters do so I would suggest the EU comes up with a solution to that conundrum that doesn't threaten the peace.

[vulcan42]

\\ Vcan @ 23 17. I don't give a stuff who N/J was quoting It was still his best answer ever.//
gulliver, I can't be bothered to explain but once again, you have proved how little you understand.

[MissTerious]

Vowed to stay away from News on AB. Just to say thank goodness we have New Judge as a well informed and very intelligent member who knows what he is talking about.

Of course there are others of intelligence on this thread among the drivel, but NJs ability to post eloquently and be understood stands out.

[JDavis]

NJ. I'm genuinely curious as to why you're so strongly pro-Brexit.

Incidentally, the latest YouGov poll suggests the majority of people now think Brexit was a mistake, so time to drop the democratic will of the people stuff, I suggest.

[JDavis]

Don't understand your logic, naomi. You're the one who brought it up.

[gulliver1]

At the end of the Day Boris got it wrong as usual
Brexit isn't working its Hurting.

[MissTerious]

Perhaps the majority of people don't actually think and expected Brexit to be wonderful. That was never going to happen. There were always going to be problems as there are with any changes. There will be people leaning towards a labour government now without any thought whatsoever. Yes, I voted Brexit, yes I knew why I did and I still would (and slogans on buses were immaterial to my vote.) I did my research and made my decisions.

Bowing out now. Too many idiots.

[cashier]

In the 1975 referendum the question was should Britain remain in the European Communities? I answered no and nothing in the time until 2016 changed my opinion. I voted leave (obviously) and would vote the same again no matter how many times the question was asked. We weren't all swayed by writing on a bus.

[gulliver1]

13,12 Bet your reason was immigration.

[New Judge]

//Incidentally, the latest YouGov poll suggests the majority of people now think Brexit was a mistake, so time to drop the democratic will of the people stuff, I suggest.//

I have never suggested it was the "democratic will of the people". I have only ever said that the then government asked a question of the electorate in 2016 and ended its booklet (aimed at getting the electorate to vote to remain) by saying "This is your decision. The
Government will implement what you decide." So we decided, and our decision was implemented (after a struggle).

I'm not sure that can be interpreted as anything but "the democratic will of the people" but it's not a term I've ever used as far as I can recall.

That said, because it was the electorate's decision then, it may not be now. But that's hardly an issue. We cannot keep having referendums on the same thing every few months in case anybody has changed their mind. That's what the EU normally insists on. Which brings me to point two:

//I'm genuinely curious as to why you're so strongly pro-Brexit.//

This was done to death (by both sides) between 2016 and 2020. But a quick precis:

I am vehemently opposed to the European Union. I believe it is a protectionist racket which discriminates against both non-EU businesses and people. Its aim is to stifle competition between its members and to make their dealings with anybody else difficult, expensive or inconvenient (and often all three). Its treaties enable it to exercise considerable power over its members whilst exhibiting a remarkable democratic deficit. The European Parliament is a sham and is only a sop to democracy. MEPs have no power to originate legislation but can only approve it. Real power is vested in a small number of unelected bureaucrats. It also runs a giant wealth distribution scheme, sucking money from four (previously five) net contributors to be paid to the other 23 members, to be spent as directed. Its Single Currency is a disaster and has inflicted financial pain and even penury on people in a number of the "peripheral" (i.e. not France or Germany) users of the Euro. The Euro's ultimate disastrous consequences are yet to be enjoyed. The Eurocrats have expanded their areas of competence "salami style" - each step just a little different to what existed before, but which, when examined end-to-end, are enormous. It retains its powers by making it so difficult for members to leave because of their economic and political entwinement, that none try (except the UK).

There's lots more besides that, but that will have to do for you to be going on with. Hopefully you can understand that because I hold those views on the EU, what happens following our departure is of little consequence. I'm not all that interested if the price of beetroot trebles.

[ToraToraTora]

13:39 judge, an excellent summary of the EUSSR, I am going cut that and use it in future I will of course credit you.

[naomi24]

JDavis, now what are you talking about? You brought the bus into this and you brought Cummngs into this. You don’t understand your own posts so it's no surprise you don't understand others.

[JDavis]

Resorting to belittling other posters as normal. You first mentioned advertising (which is a form of propaganda. Bye, naomi.

[ToraToraTora]

JDavis "NJ. I'm genuinely curious as to why you're so strongly pro-Brexit. " - what do you think of the judge's reply to you at 13:39 above?

[gulliver1]

[email protected] I have to agree with you N/Js reply at 13.39 was exellent, especially the opening part where he says YouGov poll suggests .........
"The majority of people now think Brexit was a mistake"......sorry if you had to read that part......

[naomi24]

Bye bye, JDavis.

[JDavis]

Thanks for the detailed answer, NJ. I imagine real power being invested in a small number of people is typical of every government or large organisation.

The answer to the government's question would, polls suggest, be different now so it's not easy to define democracy.

I can't see the logic of not caring what happens now. Many say they're worse off than before - I don't think the fishermen and farmers are too happy, for example. And Minister for Brexit Opportunities is so desperate that he's asked the public for help.

Mind you, I am looking forward to when I next drive through the Dartford Tunnel.

Hasn't JMR

[naomi24]

//it's not easy to define democracy//

The definition of democracy is what it is.

[gulliver1]

Whats all this about the Dartford tunnel then J/D ?

[JDavis]

Hi Gully. When JRM was asked about the benefits of brexit, he said we could change all the funny signs in the Dartford Tunnel which are currently in metres! That's good to know, anyway.