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Well Here Is One Thief That Wont Be Stealing Again
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retrocop - I recall the last time you regaled me with another of your fantasy scenarios which are not connected to the debate in any way, it ended with you in high dudgeon, promising dire consequences when the Editorial Team were advised.
And here you are doing exactly the same thing again.
With considerable caution, I will respond to your post, but be aware that if it escalates in the same way as the last time, our exchange will be considerable shorter.
Off we go then -
// You confront a burglar in the night in your house. You are threatened with a knife by the felon. You fear for your life but happen to have a cricket bat propped up by the front door.Are we expected to think you wouldn’t defend yourself after you had been stabbed by the perpetrator?
I am not sure why you are using the royal 'we', so i will address your fantasy, since it is yours alone.
You can think whatever you like, but in that fictional setting, yes i would defend myself, I think any sane person would.
// You are no atheist. You are a plaster saint with your pious logic. //
I am an atheist, I am not a 'plaster saint', and i do not have 'pious logic'.
You however, are being offensive without cause.
Ironic considering your long and florid responses when you perceive such reactions to your own rhetoric.
I am not being drawn into another pointless, tedious, nasty, de-railing row.
I have responded to your point with reason and courtesy.
How much longer we debate depends on your future responses.
And here you are doing exactly the same thing again.
With considerable caution, I will respond to your post, but be aware that if it escalates in the same way as the last time, our exchange will be considerable shorter.
Off we go then -
// You confront a burglar in the night in your house. You are threatened with a knife by the felon. You fear for your life but happen to have a cricket bat propped up by the front door.Are we expected to think you wouldn’t defend yourself after you had been stabbed by the perpetrator?
I am not sure why you are using the royal 'we', so i will address your fantasy, since it is yours alone.
You can think whatever you like, but in that fictional setting, yes i would defend myself, I think any sane person would.
// You are no atheist. You are a plaster saint with your pious logic. //
I am an atheist, I am not a 'plaster saint', and i do not have 'pious logic'.
You however, are being offensive without cause.
Ironic considering your long and florid responses when you perceive such reactions to your own rhetoric.
I am not being drawn into another pointless, tedious, nasty, de-railing row.
I have responded to your point with reason and courtesy.
How much longer we debate depends on your future responses.
fripfrip - // AH,17:58,if i had to shoot someone in self defence it would haunt me all my life,which would not be very long if you did not shoot.
I would sooner trust a honest man with a legal gun then to trust a thief with a gun. //
Whether conciously or not, you are mjaking exactly the defence offered by the National Rifle Assocation for its belief in the right to bear arms - 'The only answer to a bad man with a gun is a good man with a gun'.
That rather naively assumes that the majority of people who carry and use guns are 'good men' which is facile in the extreme.
It also conveniently ignores the proposition, that the fact carrying a gun may well have the direct consequence of turning a 'good man with a gun', into just another bad man with a gun.
I would sooner trust a honest man with a legal gun then to trust a thief with a gun. //
Whether conciously or not, you are mjaking exactly the defence offered by the National Rifle Assocation for its belief in the right to bear arms - 'The only answer to a bad man with a gun is a good man with a gun'.
That rather naively assumes that the majority of people who carry and use guns are 'good men' which is facile in the extreme.
It also conveniently ignores the proposition, that the fact carrying a gun may well have the direct consequence of turning a 'good man with a gun', into just another bad man with a gun.
America is a strange country.
They’ve given us so much in terms of technology and we’d be a poorer world without them, and yet shooting somebody dead over a road incident is deemed OK.
I will never get their fascination with guns.
Break a leg and you’re in hock for thousands, be diabetic and you pay hundreds of dollars a month for insulin when most of the world charges peanuts, if anything. It is a strange country.
And don’t even get me started on the dribbling dementia ridden most powerful man in the world…
They’ve given us so much in terms of technology and we’d be a poorer world without them, and yet shooting somebody dead over a road incident is deemed OK.
I will never get their fascination with guns.
Break a leg and you’re in hock for thousands, be diabetic and you pay hundreds of dollars a month for insulin when most of the world charges peanuts, if anything. It is a strange country.
And don’t even get me started on the dribbling dementia ridden most powerful man in the world…
Deskdiary - // America is a strange country.
They’ve given us so much in terms of technology and we’d be a poorer world without them, and yet shooting somebody dead over a road incident is deemed OK.
I will never get their fascination with guns. //
For some reason, and I don;t think anyone really knows why, the psyche of a really large part of the US population remains firmly routed in a 'frontier' mentality.
In the days when the Second Amendment was framed, the country lawless in large areas, and the right of a man to bear arms for protection was a valid and important aspect of the culture of the time.
But this is 2023, not 1823, but that attitude still remains firmly entrenched, and it means that an end to the senseless murders and mass shootings is nowhere in sight, and won't be for a very very long time.
They’ve given us so much in terms of technology and we’d be a poorer world without them, and yet shooting somebody dead over a road incident is deemed OK.
I will never get their fascination with guns. //
For some reason, and I don;t think anyone really knows why, the psyche of a really large part of the US population remains firmly routed in a 'frontier' mentality.
In the days when the Second Amendment was framed, the country lawless in large areas, and the right of a man to bear arms for protection was a valid and important aspect of the culture of the time.
But this is 2023, not 1823, but that attitude still remains firmly entrenched, and it means that an end to the senseless murders and mass shootings is nowhere in sight, and won't be for a very very long time.
retrocop - // Your faux indignation is pathetic. Can’t you answer a likely scenario truthly for once. How would you react to the incident I have described. One ,I may add, has been faced by others in the real world. Instead you sidestep the question and whine about imagined rudeness.
As usual, you are so keen to jack up the antagonism, that you fail to read my post correctly.
I did not 'sidestep' the question, -
// You can think whatever you like, but in that fictional setting, yes i would defend myself, I think any sane person would. //
And from you - // ... and whine about imagined rudeness. //
Goodnight retrocop.
As usual, you are so keen to jack up the antagonism, that you fail to read my post correctly.
I did not 'sidestep' the question, -
// You can think whatever you like, but in that fictional setting, yes i would defend myself, I think any sane person would. //
And from you - // ... and whine about imagined rudeness. //
Goodnight retrocop.
AH,i can not for the life of me think that the usa will change their constitution and the right to bear arms not a snowflake in hells chance,as for guns turning good guys in to bad guys it's still legal and that guys gun was legal nothing yet has been said about the thiefs gun,and just look around you here in england bad guys who can not get hold of a gun will find another weapon,it's not what we in england would like here to carry guns but thats how they live.
fripfrip - // AH,i can not for the life of me think that the usa will change their constitution and the right to bear arms not a snowflake in hells chance,as for guns turning good guys in to bad guys it's still legal and that guys gun was legal nothing yet has been said about the thiefs gun,and just look around you here in england bad guys who can not get hold of a gun will find another weapon,it's not what we in england would like here to carry guns but thats how they live. //
If we are going to sanction vigilante justice ending in a fatal shooting because the shooter legally owns a gun, then we are on a seriously slippery slope.
Where does this end?
You approach a car the same colour as yours, stand by the door pressing your key fob, before you realise your car is actually the next one along.
But the owner of the car you are trying to enter by mistake has shot you for trying to steal his car, but he has a legal right to hold a gun?
Not a world I would want to live in - I'm sure you would agree.
If we are going to sanction vigilante justice ending in a fatal shooting because the shooter legally owns a gun, then we are on a seriously slippery slope.
Where does this end?
You approach a car the same colour as yours, stand by the door pressing your key fob, before you realise your car is actually the next one along.
But the owner of the car you are trying to enter by mistake has shot you for trying to steal his car, but he has a legal right to hold a gun?
Not a world I would want to live in - I'm sure you would agree.
You are correct i do not want to live like that and i do not because guns are not legal here to carry around with you when you are out, but this did not happen here it happened in texas where guns can be carried legally if authorized.I'm sorry but i can not for the life of me work out why you would not shoot someone in self defence because if you did not you would be the one that was dead.
Fripfrip - I have never said that I would not shoot someone dead in self defence - I absolutely would, and have never implied otherwise, do feel free to read back through my posts.
What I have said, is that, unlike some other posters, who would be quite happy to kill someone, I would not.
Would I feel justified in my actions? Absolutely.
Would I feel happy because the other person 'deserved it'?
Absolutely not.
What I have said, is that, unlike some other posters, who would be quite happy to kill someone, I would not.
Would I feel justified in my actions? Absolutely.
Would I feel happy because the other person 'deserved it'?
Absolutely not.
//What I have said, is that, unlike some other posters, who would be quite happy to kill someone, I would not.//
Would you kindly identify those posters who have stated they would be quite happy to kill someone please. I have checked back and cannot see anyone who admitted such glee.
I was trained as a protection officer. It was my job to protect my principle and myself if our life was threatened. That was my whole raison de etre for protecting. I would of failed in my duty if I took Mr Hughes attitude. All officers had to undergo psychological profiling before they were deemed fit to carry out the onerous duty of maybe having to kill some one. Something that I doubt AH would be incapable of passing. My wife was actually interviewed as to her thoughts on my responsibilities for carrying out these duties.
I certainly wouldn't have revelled if I had taken someone's life but I sure as hell made little apples would feel shame ,remorse and disgust if my charge was killed and I failed to discharge my duty to one who entrusted me with their safety. I ask again AH who has displayed pleasure a the thought of killing another human?
Would you kindly identify those posters who have stated they would be quite happy to kill someone please. I have checked back and cannot see anyone who admitted such glee.
I was trained as a protection officer. It was my job to protect my principle and myself if our life was threatened. That was my whole raison de etre for protecting. I would of failed in my duty if I took Mr Hughes attitude. All officers had to undergo psychological profiling before they were deemed fit to carry out the onerous duty of maybe having to kill some one. Something that I doubt AH would be incapable of passing. My wife was actually interviewed as to her thoughts on my responsibilities for carrying out these duties.
I certainly wouldn't have revelled if I had taken someone's life but I sure as hell made little apples would feel shame ,remorse and disgust if my charge was killed and I failed to discharge my duty to one who entrusted me with their safety. I ask again AH who has displayed pleasure a the thought of killing another human?
if someone breaks into your house then you are robbed of any realistic choice... it would take even the most dedicated pacifist a hurculean effort of will not to do something... the same is true of soldiers in combat.
i understand why this person apprehended the thief and i cannot judge them for shooting in self-defence... but it was not a very sensible situation to bring about in the first place as they themselves have now ended up with a gunshot wound in service of... reclaiming a car that was both trackable and replacable
in my opinion that is rather stupid thing to do. i have no love for the police but if your car is stolen and you are able to track its location then that is the kind of situation they exist for
i understand why this person apprehended the thief and i cannot judge them for shooting in self-defence... but it was not a very sensible situation to bring about in the first place as they themselves have now ended up with a gunshot wound in service of... reclaiming a car that was both trackable and replacable
in my opinion that is rather stupid thing to do. i have no love for the police but if your car is stolen and you are able to track its location then that is the kind of situation they exist for
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