Shakespeare Removed By Starmer

[Khandro]

The Bard of Stratford upon Avon wrote during the reign of Elizabeth 1, she in turn was queen during a time when there was slavery, therefore ................ he has to go ! 

https://archive.ph/JwSjE

Philistinism, wokism or both ? 

[Untitled]

"I think Mr Starmer espouses the politics of a 6th form Wolfie Smith.  He's never grown up."

and we all know that real grownups dismiss criticisms of imperialism as petulant and woke lol

[Bazile]

NJ

How much did you pay for your -Pam Ayres poetry collection ? 😁

[Khandro]

NJ, You surprise me, perhaps you too don't have a soul?

[bednobs]

really oddly, NJ i woke upthinking about cargoes about a week ago.  I have no idea why, as i havent thought about it since i was 12 and Mrs Mcrae, my english teacher made me write a discourse on the imagery in it, for which i wanted to write "he put the words in that order coz he wanted to - it doesnt have to 'mean' anything"

[Khandro]

'What this country needed was a leader who could make a passionate and convincing case for the importance of literature, and its life-changing powers. What we got instead was an Arsenal obsessive. Good for football; bad for our country’s intellectual growth. Shakespeare, at least, had it about right, when he wrote in Richard III ‘Woe to that land that is governed by a child’. If Starmer could be prevailed upon to study the plays, he might find it desirable to bear his words in mind.' 

[New Judge]

"NJ

How much did you pay for your Pam Ayres poetry collection ? 😁"

Nothing so sophisticated as that on my bookshelves, Baz. My poetry collection extends only so far as the rhyming couplets under each of the pictures in my "Rupert" annuals. I mean, just look at this from “Rupert and the Butterflies”:

He’s told “be careful not to fall..                  

That scent will spill – you’ll lose it all”

 

“I think a thief is hiding here”

Warns PC Growler – “Don’t go near”

 

The wood is risky, Rupert knows.

And so another way he goes

 

Just look what I have Rupert cries

As Mr Bear turns in surprise.

William Wordsworth? John Masefield? Eat your hearts out.

"NJ, You surprise me, perhaps you too don't have a soul?"

I do, Khandro. Honest I do. I’s just that that I like words to be in the right order and whatever I’m reading to actually have some meaning.

"he put the words in that order coz he wanted to - it doesnt have to 'mean' anything"

Exactly, bednobs. You’ve hit the nail on the head. You shouldn’t need to analyse a short passage to find out what it means. The writer should say what he means and if he can’t then he shouldn’t bother.

Sorry but poetry for me is a bit like abstract painting. In the words of Anthony Aloysius Hanock in the film “The Rebel" – it’s rubbish! 

However, I fear we digress!!!  😂🤣😀

[Bazile]

//What this country needed was a leader who could make a passionate and convincing case for the importance of literature, and its life-changing powers. //

What are those life Changing powers ?

 

[Khandro]

//What are those life Changing powers ?//

Oh dear !!

[bednobs]

maybe i would have been a millionnaireif i had been forced to study more than romeo and juliet and macbeth at school.

I had a pretty nice night out watching measure for measure once, but i dont think it chnaged my life

[naomi24]

Khandro, you're getting all airy fairy again.  I don't think Mr Starmer's appreciation or otherwise of literature matters a jot to this discussion.   I believe he is weak and is guided by an overwhelming urge to be seen and heard to be politically correct.   That's why he said some women have penises.  

[New Judge]

//What are those life Changing powers ?//

Oh dear !!

No, come on, come on, Khandro. You can't get away with it that easily and dismiss as Philistines those who don't rate litereature as a force to rid the world of all evil without explanation.

What are these life changing powers that will be bestowed upon people who read the Great Works of Literature?

[Khandro]

I wouldn't know where to begin, and whatever I  said would I'm sure, be seen in this theatre, as pretentious.

[Atheist]

NJ; Have you read any of Betjeman's poetry? He rhymes.

[Bazile]

Khandro

Your 'o dear ' in response to my question was insinuating some sort of ignorance on my part .

So come on let's have some examples 

[Khandro]

I'll risk naomi's 'airy fairy' and say that this very afternoon, with a nice cup of tea, I read Michael Goves' (favourable) review of Boris' new book, and he begins with making a light-hearted imaginary collaboration between Virgil and Capt. W.E. Johns. 

If you haven't read the Aeneid or Biggles the fun might be lost on you.

[naomi24]

Khandro, where are you going with this?  You've posted a serious news item - and then derailed your own thread.  

[bednobs]

TBH i'd hardly cite understanding a joke in a book review as life changing

[douglas9401]

In everyday life quote the bard

Defining importance is hard

You can chunter away

Thinking life is a play

In reality though, a canard 

[Khandro]

naomi; The thread isn't derailed; 'philistinism' is clearly mentioned in the OP, & there's a lot of it about.

Two things I detest are, anti-intellectualism (see the Bolsheviks)  & inverted snobbery, which posits that ignorance is somehow a virtue.

Go figure.  

[New Judge]

"NJ; Have you read any of Betjeman's poetry?"

Nope.

In fact, apart from the two I've already mentioned I think the only other poem I can recall reading at school was "Naming of Parts" by Henry somebody or other. As I recall the only reason this has stuck in my mind is because at the time we had a particularly attractive young female English mistress and there was some sniggering among my form mates when we got to the bit about the the bolt action and "easing the spring". I'm sure she picked up our amusment but we were treated to an early cold shower when the bees and the flowers were mentioned.

Since leaving school I can't recall ever reading any poetry (unless you count E.J. Thribb's obituaries in Private Eye and one or two filthy Limericks - and, of course, Rupert Bear). It's just not my thing at all.

"...& inverted snobbery, which posits that ignorance is somehow a virtue"

Me too, Khandro. In particular people who say "I'm hopeless at maths" after being asked to divide ten by two.

But we can't all know everything about everything. We have to choose. I know quite a lot about  very small number of things, a reasonable amount about a slightly larger number of things, I have a smattering of knowlege (enough to have a chat down the pub) about  quite a few things and next to nothing about an awful lot of things.  Literature in general and poetry in particular fits firmly into that last category.