Half of all single mothers don't want to work

[AB Asks]

A report has found that half of single mothers don't want to work. Labour is trying to reduce the number of people on living on benefits and current schemes to get lone parents into work are currently failing. There have been some discussions over the summer about withdrawing benefits from those who outright refuse to work. This approach was taken in the US by Bill Clinton in the nineties and proved successful. Labour is instead going to offer more incentives and extra benefits to encourage people to work. What do you think? Should we act like Clinton and withdraw benefits if these people refuse to work? Or are more and better incentives the way to encourage lone parents back into a job?

[LoftyLottie]

That's just it, Annie, 'out of a job'. Nursery staff are in nurseries basically to earn money - that is the main priority. I would not like my children cared for daily by someone who is doing it as a job. I would not have trusted anyone I don't know personally to look after my pre school children on a permanent basis, however well trained and 'professional' they were. And training loads of people in child care so that the Government can fulfil it's plan of a nursery place for every child is a great way to bring unemployment down!

There are a lot of bad parents, equally there are a lot of bad childcare workers. Far more importantly there are many more good parents than bad parents. Unfortunately for them, these parents often need financial support and I for one am very happy to support them in raising their children.

For the third time of saying, I firmly believe that the breakdown of society has a great deal to do with lack of parenting in formative years. I also think that it's due to a society that sees giving their children nice things more important than giving their children their time. Too much of my taxes are going towards paying for problems caused by anti social behaviour. Old fashioned or not, I believe we need to get back to some proper values in family life.

[LoftyLottie]

My children have certainly grown up with a work ethic. I have worked all my life, except for those first early years and my husband is one of the hardest workers I have every known - doing extra jobs when the children were little so that we could just about make ends meet. My children both got themselves jobs whilst they were at college and have continued to work and work hard.

I think there are a lot of selfish people around who can't see outside of their own existence, or have no empathy or concern for others - they are too quick to tar everybody with the same brush.

Oooh, I did have some state benefits - Child Allowance. Do any of you refuse this?

I have not slated off anyone of this thread. Just given my views.

I hope that none of your who are so bitter about people on benefits never find yourself in a position of needing help yourselves.

[LoftyLottie]

aims 1202 - I totally agree with your last posting. Good luck in your new relationship!

[annie0000]

Loftylottie - I hear what you are saying about the breakdown of society, but unless you impose rules on how children on benefits are raised - which you can't do, a very high proportion are getting a very raw deal. In these cases they benefit far more from a structured and enjoyable childcare experience rather than substandard parenting.

I think statistically, children from homes where the parents are working are less likely to be involved in antisocial behaviour than children from households who live on benefits. If you don't believe me you are welcome to come and visit me and I will show you. Having said that I am sure that there are parents on both sides of the benefit scale that are good or bad parents.

I also have no problem with paying tax to fund benefits for people who need it - I have never been in this position although I have been been redundant twice and my husband suffers poor health and did not work for nearly 2 years - the message being that there is work there for people who want and are able to do it.

Whilst it would be wonderful if all children had loving, competent parents who were financially able to stay at home with them while they were little. The reality is that this is just not viable with the way that society is structured. There is not an easy solution to this one.

My argument still remains that people think that they should have a choice even if that choice stops other people having the same choice. This is very selfish. I think working parents get a raw deal. i am not speaking from personal circumstances.

Also, the begining bit of my last post did not appear - I was basically saying that I was not directing my comments at anyone in particular unless I have specifically named that person and that I was very careful not to blame single parents as there are many couples who do exactly the same thing.

[annie0000]

cont./
I would also rather not be a single parent as I do believe it is a very hard job bringing up children. It is better to be able to share the joys and stresses with a partner.

[LoftyLottie]

Fair points Annie. Don't forget though I am only talking about pre-school children where they are bundled off each day to childminders/nurseries and the only contact they get with their parents are a few hours each evening and at weekends. Parents talk about having 'quality time' with their kids, which I personaly think is a load of rubbish. Kids need a taste of the real world in those early years, the ups and downs of living and socialising with a wide range of people in a wide range of situations.


There are good and bad parents in all sectors. In my work I have come across many children who have spent their early days in nursery schools, both from rich and poor homes, and a great deal of them just can't socialise in mixed company, and more to the point have been the disruptive ones in the classroom more often than not.

You can't impose rules on how any children are raised , but a great deal of children on benefits are raised in loving, caring homes - and unfortunately there are are great number of children where both parents work who really don't get the same care and attention.

By the way, I don't believe in breakfast clubs or after school clubs for kids either!

We will have to agree to differ in our opinions, although I am sure there are some points we do agree on in that we both want the best for our children.

[LoftyLottie]

Interesting - and I admit non conclusive, but there are arguments for and against. I only found this after posting my last response, so my views were not influenced by this article - I don't read The Guardian.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/story/ 0,,2049653,00.html

The comments following the article show much much people differ in their feelings on childcare.

[annie0000]

Hi LoftyLottie - you are right in that we both obviously want the best for our kids - and for other peoples - and we will never agree, I don't think that the solution is leaving children in badly parented homes rather than in a proper childcare facility - I will check out the article later. I am still in the enviable position in that although my kids are in school, I finsh in time to pick them up everyday. i do unfortunately have to use a breakfast club from 8.15, and yes I do feel guilty about that, but am i damaging my children? i don't think so. I see lots of kids wandering the streets at that time that would be better of in the breakfast club (which incidentally is free, so there is no excuse)

I think that a variety of childcare is the best option, I too feel sorry for young children deposited in nurseries for 10 hours a day, but I don't feel that people who are living on the benefits provided by these working parents have the right to turn round and accuse them of not doing the best for their children.

[LoftyLottie]

Yes, but don't forget lots of those wandering children are latch key kids whose parents are working.

Your emphasis seems to be on 'badly parented homes'. I know that a proportion of people on benefits are bad parents, but I refuse to believe that proportionately there are more bad parents in this group. Surely the type of people you refer to where their kids would be better off in childcare are not exactly the type you would want in the workplace either!

No real solution. I just think that the 'youth yob culture' we are now witnessing is due to the lack of proper parenting and the materialistic attitudes of the 80's.

[annie0000]

Actually i know for a fact that the kids I see hanging about may be latch key kids, but their parents are not working and claiming benefits. As we have both said, it depends on what you see and what you have experienced. I agree there are some good parents on benefits and some bad ones who work, but imo the balance is as I have said - it may be very different where you live. The difference is that the parents who are working and raising bad antiscoial kids have at least contributed to the economy and paid for the police that are required to deal with the aftermath. The parents on benefits haven't.

[LoftyLottie]

So basically, Annie, you only want benefits to go to people that have paid into the system? How many years worth of paying into the system would mean you could claim back? Or would the amount you have paid in count? Sorry, I don't think that is an argument.

I pay my council tax but I can't or don't want to take advantage of many of tghe facilities that I pay for. I don't begrudge them to others though ior get annoyed about

[netibiza]

Not such a bad idea, here in Spain, you can only claim for 6months if you have previously worked for 6months - no scroungers here, you can of course work for 5 years without claiming and then you can claim for 5 years.

[someguy0000]

as a single mother for a very long time,i am quite knowledgable about this subject,
Its not that easy to be able to work........to be quite honest with you ,any person who is a single parent and worth there weight would work, but unfortunately for some it does nt quite work like that.
I was never given a house, i never had maintanace, if i had got the money my son deserved it might have been viable for me to work.
some people think that living on �100 a week is a synch, well let me tell you its not.
i would have to earn over �18500 a year just to break even, that would mean me having to work probably in the region of 50 -60 hours a week, never seeing my son, having to fork out for a child minder.
when i was working i found myself getting further in debt because i was not getting the right help........
i dont know the solution , all i know is that working is a luxury that i cant afford...........so there!!! rant over

[LoftyLottie]

Don't forget that most of the benefits paid to these people will be for income support, housing benefit, incapacity benefit though Netibiza, not Unemployment Benefit. Also most of them will be people that have been born and bred in this country and a lot will have been making contributions before their present situation. If we stop benefits it is the children that will suffer most. I can't see where a line can be drawn on who can claim and who can't.

Yes we need to tighten up on those that are perfectly capable of working or those that are working and claiming benefits, but I think it should be financially possible for one parent to be at home with young children. II personally think that Aims2000 has the best idea - take away all the stupid working tax credits, childrens tax credits , and all the other whim of the moment payments and pay a sum of money to 'every' family with children under five years whether on benefits or not so that one parent can stay at home with the children. They could forfeit that payment if they wished to work.

I think we need to cut down on nursery care, not increase it.

And I hate to say it because of the reaction but I don't think that working mothers of young children make good employees. Good mothers will always put their children first and their employee last and who wants stressed out or missing employees because their children are sick, or staff training days, etc. Is it really good for children to spend their school holidays on child play schemes or being brought up by granny.

I will go now - that's a promise.

[slave-plater]

in the herts area a few years ago, the government funded enterprise board, were offering lone parents, courses to become child care assistants qualified, with college courses involved , the idea was that these "CHILD CARE WOULD BE ASSISTANTS " would qualify, get of benefits, go to a suitable job related to child care.....however in the agreement , is that the goverment would pay for creche services needed by these get back to work mothers, this planned extra cost was planned , while they were training and after when they went back to work, if they ever did ....... still expenses mounted up for the goverment ........