In memory of those who died.

[Lonnie]

I've put this on here, as this site seemed the most appropiate.
Please read, as it should concern us all.

It may take a couple of posts.

Please take the time to read this in memory of all those that died



It is a matter of history that when Supreme Commander of the Allied Forces, General Dwight Eisenhower, found the victims of the death camps he order ed all possible photographs to be taken and for the German people from surrounding villages to be ushered through the camps and even made to bury the dead.

He did this because he said in words to this effect: ' Get it all on record now - get the films - get the witnesses - because somewhere down the track of history some ******* will get up and say that this never happened'

All that is necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing.

Edmund Burke

In Memorial

[persianlady]

Thank God for that! I would still like to know how anyone can possibly deny or even believe that it did not happen. Can anyone direct me to a source that will educate me about holocaust denial.

[Gromit]

"This week, the UK removed The Holocaust from its school curriculum because it 'offended' the Muslim population which claims it never occurred.'

This story is from March (not this week). It is totally untrue that it has been removed because it offended muslims.

I look forward to reading your apology for misleading us here and perpetuating lies.

[Gromit]

"This week, the UK removed The Holocaust from its school curriculum because it 'offended' the Muslim population which claims it never occurred.'

This story is from March (not this week). It is totally untrue that it has been removed because it offended muslims.

I look forward to reading your apology for misleading us here and perpetuating lies.

[4GS]

Lonnie
Hi, not sure whether or not the holocaust has been removed from the curriculum, suffice to say that I hope it will always be taught.

Yasher koach

[Booldawg]

TBH the reported deaths of the Russian Revolution under the hands of Josef Stalin due to murder, starvation and disease were 120 million. This makes it the largest holocaust of the 20th century. Not sure if its ever appeared on the school curriculum, if any 'international centres of learning' have been built or if any emotive Hollywood films or Discovery Channel docus have been peddled out on a regular basis to remind us of the atrocities.

[amonty1144]

I think there is a wider issue here than whether it has been removed and it seems to be this all encroaching censorship that is creeping into our lives and schools. It is common knowledge that references or pictures of people smoking are being removed and in the US I hear that shop workers no longer wish Happy Christmas but say Happy holidays to avoid offence.

There are holocaust deniers and there are those who wish to stir up religious hatred, we must all be aware that they are out there.

For a real hair on end experience then visit Auschwitz, you can't deny that.

[Pippa68]

My son (year 10) has learned about the holocaust.

His class watched 'Schindlers List' and a trip to Auschwitz was going to be organised. My son dearly wanted to go, but unfortunately there wasn't enough interest.

I had already told my children about the holocaust and Nazi Germany ~ I feel it should be on the curriculum because there are many parents who either don't know enough about it themselves or just aren't interested.

We have to keep teaching..it may be the only way to make sure it will NEVER happen again.

BOO ~ my 17 year old didn't learn about it in school either.

[Supernick]

This is one of those awful internet lies that starts up and gets passed around millions. Why do people treat a viral e-mail as gospel truth????

[sp1814]

You know what?

I'm getting a bit worried about people blaming Muslims for everything.

It's happens like this...someone makes up a lie. The lie is proven untrue, but it gains currency and months later people quote it as true.

However, the seed it planted in people's minds and the story grows wings.

Seeing as this thread is now based on a complete untruth Lonnie, how about getting it deleted?

The Holocaust will never, ever, ever, ever be forgotten, no matter how much scum like Hutton Gibson (father of the famous anti-semite Mel) and David Irving claim.

[ruby27]

Its estimated that 250,000 to 500,000 Gypsies were killed.

Why were they not mentioned in the orginal post?

A quote from a Jewish web site.
"and that proportionately they suffered losses greater than any other group of victims except Jews".

[Clanad]

I've observed and communicated with Lonnie for some time now and would never think he would knowingly perpetrate or spread a hoax. It's apparent, from all the literature, electronic and otherwise, that attempts to suppress or denigrate the historicity of the Holocaust is a fact of life in many locations, including here in the U.S. If one would take the time to read this article you'll find that the attempts at suppression are politically motivated and extend back to about 1973... the Arab oil embargo.

News articles do verify that at least one school in the U.K. has elected to eliminate the subject and several other articles explain that it appears to be a teacher driven option.

The clouds are on the horizon, such as: "... The European response to the Arab oil weapon was both swift and craven. Meeting in Brussels on November 6, 1973, two weeks after the war's end, the nine foreign ministers of the European Economic Community (EEC) issued an unambiguously pro-Arab statement listing what they regarded as essential requirements for Middle East peace..." Further: "...In January 2005, for example, Sir Iqbal Sacranie, O.B.E., Secretary General of the Muslim Council of Britain, wrote to Charles Clarke, the British Home Secretary, saying that the Muslim Council would not attend Holocaust Memorial Day, a national observance under the patronage of the Queen, unless it included the "holocaust" of the Palestinian Intifada (Sunday Times, London, January 23, 2005). In July 2005, some members of the Prime Minister's all-Muslim advisory committee on Islamic affairs called for the abolition of Holocaust Memorial Day altogether "because it is offensive to Muslims." (Source: Sunday Times, London, January 23, 2005)
Coming soon to a city near you?

[Gromit]

Clanad,

I am happy to update your information as regards the Holocaust memorial Day Boycott.

"On December 3 2007, the MCB voted to end the boycott. Assistant general secretary Inayat Bunglawala argued it was 'inadvertently causing hurt to some in the Jewish community'."

http://www.guardian.co.uk/uk_news/story/0,,222 0780,00.html

[Goodsoulette]

As one of the questions above say why do people believe what is written in an Email. Why do those that gasp at it immediately give it credence. If you got an email saying fairies riding on pony back are coming to take your children, would you immediately believe it.

Like Sp, it really troubles me that Muslims are getting the blame for everything. I also find it odd that some nasty piece of work is using the holocaust as tool to make people hate an entire religion's people. Dislike for an entire religion and believing all the propoganda thats fed to us regarding them, now where exactly have I read about that sort of thing going on before???

[Clanad]

That's good Gromit as far as it goes... but this paragraph is full of implications, do you not agree?

"...Daud Abdullah, the council's deputy secretary general, voted against attending and said: "I'm against it [attending]. Nothing has changed, we saw no reason why it [the boycott] should change."...

[Gromit]

Clanad, No, it is not an unequivical endorsement, but at least their mistake has been rectified.

A Genocide Day which could encompass all the different peoples, including Jews, who have suffered, has merit don't you think? The boycott of HMD was more to do with no memorial for Muslims that have suffered rather than denying the Jews have suffered.

[Supernick]

I think it's important to note that the MCGB were not denying the holocaust before now.

They were (ill advisedly) boycotting it for not encompassing other genocides, a fact refuted by the orgnisers. They have voted and realised they have made an error, yet some would still boycott due to the aforementioned reason

[Lonnie]

Some very interesting and diverse answers, and thanks to all for making it an interesting debate.

As I said earlier, this was on an email that I got from an old army buddy, it said 'This week', and I apologise for not checking it out first, however, the gist of it is true, also, the Holocaust, even though it immediantly makes you think of Jews, as in the post, its also about many others.

I also apologise to those who think something is not there when it should be, I copied it, and thats what was in it.

I notice one person thinks it should be deleted, well, nothing stopping you or anyone else reporting it.

I work with a people of many races and religions, and a short time ago, had an arguement, (me argueing)?, with a Muslim female driver, because she says there's no proof the Holocaust happened, a few years ago, this same person, when she found out I was Jewish, promptly said, 'that makes us enemies then', before that, we'd got on very well.
Thats a personal experience.

Clanad,
Thanks for the reference.

[sp1814]

Lonnie

I remember you telling that story before ("That makes us enemies then"), and I still believe that the person you were talking to was a ****** first and a Muslim second.

Muslims and Christians (to name just two) have pretty nasty opinions of gays/lesbians, but to call someone an enemy because of their faith, rather than who they are is shortsighted and frankly...stupid.

[Lonnie]

Hi sp,
That story is very very true, afraid its something I just can't get out of my head, the other part is also true.