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Bullying
My soon to be 9 year old son has been having some bother with a few of the boys at school. A few months ago I found out that 3 boys in his class together with a few others from younger classes had been throwing sticks and ganging up on my son in general. I reported it to the school and they boys were "talked to". I found out this weekend that they are now calling him names and teasing him and generally making his life a misery (no hitting though).
The main ringleader is in his class and I know his mum reasonably well, she thinks the sun shines out his backside, personally I think he has a face that you wouldn't tire of punching!
We have never had that much to do with the family really as my younger son (almost 8) has always hated the sight of this boy (since he was about 3!) and they have never got on. My elder boy is really quiet and has a couple of close friends who are pretty much like him.
Anyway, I would value some opinions on possible action next.
My husband feels that he needs to learn to sort this kind of thing out for himself and win or lose, he thinks that next time he is provoked my son should fight this boy to show that he is not just going to take the bullying.
My younger son wants to go and help his brother and would quite happily punch the boys lights out (as he puts it) however he is in the infants playground until after the holidays so is generally not around to support his brother.
My son wants me to go and speak to the teacher again.
Other options are:
to go and speak to the boy's Mum
speak to the boy myself and leave him no doubt how hard I would kick his backside if he so much as breathes the same air as my son
or anything else you guys can come up with.
There are now only 3 weeks left of the school year but they will all still be in the same class after the summer.
The main ringleader is in his class and I know his mum reasonably well, she thinks the sun shines out his backside, personally I think he has a face that you wouldn't tire of punching!
We have never had that much to do with the family really as my younger son (almost 8) has always hated the sight of this boy (since he was about 3!) and they have never got on. My elder boy is really quiet and has a couple of close friends who are pretty much like him.
Anyway, I would value some opinions on possible action next.
My husband feels that he needs to learn to sort this kind of thing out for himself and win or lose, he thinks that next time he is provoked my son should fight this boy to show that he is not just going to take the bullying.
My younger son wants to go and help his brother and would quite happily punch the boys lights out (as he puts it) however he is in the infants playground until after the holidays so is generally not around to support his brother.
My son wants me to go and speak to the teacher again.
Other options are:
to go and speak to the boy's Mum
speak to the boy myself and leave him no doubt how hard I would kick his backside if he so much as breathes the same air as my son
or anything else you guys can come up with.
There are now only 3 weeks left of the school year but they will all still be in the same class after the summer.
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I can see the temptation, but you really can't threaten the other child. I don't think talking to him would solve the problem.
I would a) go to the school, speak with the head teacher and ask about their anti-bullying policy, then ask them precisely how they are going to deal with this.
then b) make sure your son has a good group of friends around him. make an effort to have them over or take them out over the summer hols, so he always has friends to turn to at school.
best of luck, it's a nightmare situation x
I would a) go to the school, speak with the head teacher and ask about their anti-bullying policy, then ask them precisely how they are going to deal with this.
then b) make sure your son has a good group of friends around him. make an effort to have them over or take them out over the summer hols, so he always has friends to turn to at school.
best of luck, it's a nightmare situation x
Hi sara - the school recently consulted parents on the rewriting of its bullying policy, we were unable to attend as the boys attend a lot of activities and I was at judo and my other half at swimming. I am pretty sure the bully's mum was there though - typical. We haven't seen the policy that they come up with yet though.
He does have friends, but I know for a fact that one of them has had the same problem but that was in the classroom and he was moved seats. I usually have a house full of boys. His little group are scared of this boy (he is a big lad - my son is the only one in the class bigger than him). My son is big, muscular and attends judo and has played rugby, so he not physically a wimp, but he is quiet - really quiet and he wears glasses so he is a target.
I am inclined to think that as it is so close to the end of school, that they will not be interested in dealing with the problem.
He does have friends, but I know for a fact that one of them has had the same problem but that was in the classroom and he was moved seats. I usually have a house full of boys. His little group are scared of this boy (he is a big lad - my son is the only one in the class bigger than him). My son is big, muscular and attends judo and has played rugby, so he not physically a wimp, but he is quiet - really quiet and he wears glasses so he is a target.
I am inclined to think that as it is so close to the end of school, that they will not be interested in dealing with the problem.
Hi zzxxee, I have though about a move of school, but that is not so easy really, he is a millenium baby so the schools are all packed for that year and I would also have to get a place for my younger son. The next nearest school is always oversubscribed and to be honest I am not sure if running away from the problem would really help my son in the long term. I am tempted to speak to the parents, but maybe the dad rather than the mum - might get a more balanced view - the dad looks okay.
I had same kind of problems with my son and tend to agree with your husband. We saw the teacher about it and although she was really understanding about it, it never really stopped until the day he finally lost his temper and stood up for himself. I know you don't want them to become violent or become like the bully themselves but I believe if they don't learn to look after themselves they suffer for it later on. My son is now 13 and because he can now stick up for himself he has had no problems going from primary to comprehensive school, where others who parents constantly fight their battles for them are having problems.
If the school is going to the trouble of holding meetings for parents to discuss bullying maybe next time you should make the effort and go!
If the school is going to the trouble of holding meetings for parents to discuss bullying maybe next time you should make the effort and go!
Speaking as a teacher and the mum of a boy who was also bullied at primary school, the best advice I can give you is to go back to the school.
But before you do that, keep a log of every incident (and I mean every incident) with times, dates and places. Make sure your son reports these to the staff on duty when they do happen. If possible, write down your son's version of events - a witness statement if you like. And note down which other children saw it happen.
Then go back to the school.
Explain the situation is still going on, 'talking' to the boys hasn't worked (rarely does in my experience) and ask quite forcefully what the boys' parents have had to say about it (not -have they been told?). Assume the school has contacted them - from the sound of it they haven't done so, but they won't admit that and you'll be putting them on the spot.
Show the log (take a copy first), and ask whether any staff have seen these incidents, were they there? If it's at playtime, what were the staff doing?
Most schools still try to deal with this in-house, ie without bringing parents into it - mainly because as you point out, they think the sun shines out of every orifice and will kick off big style if the school 'accuses' their child of anything.
Insist politely that this has to stop and stop now, otherwise you will pursue this as per the school's policy. A simple "I will take this further" will do.
Your son has rights, including the right to an education without fear or intimidation, and it is the school's responsibility to deal with this.
Failing that, tactics that usually get an immediate response are - write to your MP, threaten to take legal action, write to the papers.
Good Luck.
But before you do that, keep a log of every incident (and I mean every incident) with times, dates and places. Make sure your son reports these to the staff on duty when they do happen. If possible, write down your son's version of events - a witness statement if you like. And note down which other children saw it happen.
Then go back to the school.
Explain the situation is still going on, 'talking' to the boys hasn't worked (rarely does in my experience) and ask quite forcefully what the boys' parents have had to say about it (not -have they been told?). Assume the school has contacted them - from the sound of it they haven't done so, but they won't admit that and you'll be putting them on the spot.
Show the log (take a copy first), and ask whether any staff have seen these incidents, were they there? If it's at playtime, what were the staff doing?
Most schools still try to deal with this in-house, ie without bringing parents into it - mainly because as you point out, they think the sun shines out of every orifice and will kick off big style if the school 'accuses' their child of anything.
Insist politely that this has to stop and stop now, otherwise you will pursue this as per the school's policy. A simple "I will take this further" will do.
Your son has rights, including the right to an education without fear or intimidation, and it is the school's responsibility to deal with this.
Failing that, tactics that usually get an immediate response are - write to your MP, threaten to take legal action, write to the papers.
Good Luck.
Some really helpful thoughts there - we need to mull it over and decide what to do for Monday. Jkelly - some thoughts there, but as for your last comment - I already pointed out that we already had other commitments with our sons. I thought that the bullying had been dealt with at that point as my son did not say that he was having any more problems, and yes, I did ask him. It is hardly a case of not making any effort. My husband and I both work full time although I finish at 3 so that I can pick the boys up every day, we have no relatives near by, we dont leave the boys with anybody, we make sure that we spend family time together and take them out to activities virtually every night of the week. They have friends over all the time, in fact my husband is just back from a scout event with them and two friends and they are all in the play room having a wii sport tournament. Lack of effort is not a comment that I am prepared to accept.
You may find this negative and uncaring but isn't this all part of "growing up and being British", as the saying goes?
Not that I'm condoning such behaviour, however, it's the type of thing which has been going on amongst kids for who knows how long and nobody has ever found a solution.
I'll bet near enough everyone on here has either been bullied, been a bully, or knows of someone who was bullied as a kid. My really unscientific opinion is that it's a cancer in society but happens because the role models for most kids, adults, indulge in similar activity in every walk of life and kids, being ultra perceptive and impressionable, pick up on this very quickly and put it into practice with their own peers.
As I say, it is unacceptable but is inevitably something which will undoubtedly still be going on long after all of us are gone.
Best of luck, annie, I do have sympathy for you and your family's plight.
I have to say, however, that when I went to school we still had corporal punishment which at least helped to keep such behaviour to a minimum, but how can teachers hope to dissuade would-be bullies nowadays? They can't even look at them the wrong way without being faced with suspension or the sack.
Could anyone who believes I'm totally wrong please tell me what the effective solution to this is?
Not that I'm condoning such behaviour, however, it's the type of thing which has been going on amongst kids for who knows how long and nobody has ever found a solution.
I'll bet near enough everyone on here has either been bullied, been a bully, or knows of someone who was bullied as a kid. My really unscientific opinion is that it's a cancer in society but happens because the role models for most kids, adults, indulge in similar activity in every walk of life and kids, being ultra perceptive and impressionable, pick up on this very quickly and put it into practice with their own peers.
As I say, it is unacceptable but is inevitably something which will undoubtedly still be going on long after all of us are gone.
Best of luck, annie, I do have sympathy for you and your family's plight.
I have to say, however, that when I went to school we still had corporal punishment which at least helped to keep such behaviour to a minimum, but how can teachers hope to dissuade would-be bullies nowadays? They can't even look at them the wrong way without being faced with suspension or the sack.
Could anyone who believes I'm totally wrong please tell me what the effective solution to this is?
Annie, I can sympathise with this one because we have been trying for 3 years to get the school to do something about a boy that the school openly admit has a grudge against my daughter. In my un -pc opinion, this boy shouldn't be in mainstream education -he has persistant behavioural problems and it constantly disrupting the class.
We have spoken to the Head many times, Have spoken to the mother who was totally ineffective, my daughter has filled in mountains of bully reports but the school do very little.
In actuality I think there is very little they can do, the whole system is based on rewards for good behaviour rather than punishing bad behaviour and while this is enough for most children, the prospect of losing ten minutes Golden Time is not much of a detterent for a child that is at the level of threatening to stab classmates!
As for taking my daughters out the school - why the hell should I! it's overall a great school and less than five minutes walk from our home. My daughters have every right to be there and I'm not going to teach them to run away from bullies.
Like your son, they will be stuck with this boy again next term and I will be telling them to keep trying to avoid this boy but if he hits them they've to hit him back as hard as they can! I really hope they will only have to do this once or twice before he gets fed up.
This is more of a rant than a helpful answer but I know you live fairly close to me so may find yourselves up against the same dead end school policies. I think you would find that the school would deal with your son sympathetically if he were to lose his temper and lash out against a known bully.
Hope it gets sorted soon, I know it's horrible to have a child going through this.
We have spoken to the Head many times, Have spoken to the mother who was totally ineffective, my daughter has filled in mountains of bully reports but the school do very little.
In actuality I think there is very little they can do, the whole system is based on rewards for good behaviour rather than punishing bad behaviour and while this is enough for most children, the prospect of losing ten minutes Golden Time is not much of a detterent for a child that is at the level of threatening to stab classmates!
As for taking my daughters out the school - why the hell should I! it's overall a great school and less than five minutes walk from our home. My daughters have every right to be there and I'm not going to teach them to run away from bullies.
Like your son, they will be stuck with this boy again next term and I will be telling them to keep trying to avoid this boy but if he hits them they've to hit him back as hard as they can! I really hope they will only have to do this once or twice before he gets fed up.
This is more of a rant than a helpful answer but I know you live fairly close to me so may find yourselves up against the same dead end school policies. I think you would find that the school would deal with your son sympathetically if he were to lose his temper and lash out against a known bully.
Hope it gets sorted soon, I know it's horrible to have a child going through this.
Hi paraffin, actually your post comes across as neither negative or uncaring. I know exactly what you mean, however, I don't believe that we should just accept it. My husband and I were both brought up in quite rough areas in a time where kids were given a lot more freedom than they have now. Consequently, despite both being shy kids, we developed a way of avoiding trouble or dealing with the little bits that did come our way. The problem we now have, is that we have probably protected our kids too much and they haven't the capacity or tools to deal with trouble. That is our fault and my son shouldn't suffer for that. While my head tells me that I should let him sort it out for himself, my heart tells me to protect my son and also to kick the little sh!ts backside.
We are trying to give me son some suitable responses to give when the teasing starts and I am going to ask to see the head on Monday - as an absolute minimum, I want this to be raised in their school reports.
We are trying to give me son some suitable responses to give when the teasing starts and I am going to ask to see the head on Monday - as an absolute minimum, I want this to be raised in their school reports.
Hi yingyang - what a nightmare for your daughter. The boys involved here generally come from "good homes" on the private estate where we live and not from the large council estate as you may expect. Before anyone jumps on that, I come from exactly the same type of estate and I have great experience of it.
I know that if it was my son, he wouldn't see the light of day for a very long time.
That's a good point about them being sympathetic if he does end up hitting them, all the more reason for me to report it again, I also want it detailed in their school report so that it is on record. We are working on some good putdowns - I think I will canvas chatterbank for some suggestions - his main repsonse at the moment seems to be limited to "so"!
I really hope that you manage to sort something out for your daughter - watch chetterbank soon to see if we get any useful suggestions!
Amazingly, by younger son seems to be well able to deal with taunts - we were at the park today in one of the hillfoots villages and he was sitting in the climbing frame eating an ice cream when a group of about 6 little girls, I would say ages between 10 and 6, joined him on it and started saying things about men being stupid, trying to guess his age (7) and saying things about his hair - he is growing it long just now and looks more pretty than handsome! Anyway, he finished his ice cream and turned to the ring leader and said - "you are only saying that because you want to kiss me - well you can kiss my ass - you are not even in my league" I had to stifle a laugh - I have no idea where he gets his confidence from (btw he was right - but I would say that!!).
All the best to you and your wee ones.
I know that if it was my son, he wouldn't see the light of day for a very long time.
That's a good point about them being sympathetic if he does end up hitting them, all the more reason for me to report it again, I also want it detailed in their school report so that it is on record. We are working on some good putdowns - I think I will canvas chatterbank for some suggestions - his main repsonse at the moment seems to be limited to "so"!
I really hope that you manage to sort something out for your daughter - watch chetterbank soon to see if we get any useful suggestions!
Amazingly, by younger son seems to be well able to deal with taunts - we were at the park today in one of the hillfoots villages and he was sitting in the climbing frame eating an ice cream when a group of about 6 little girls, I would say ages between 10 and 6, joined him on it and started saying things about men being stupid, trying to guess his age (7) and saying things about his hair - he is growing it long just now and looks more pretty than handsome! Anyway, he finished his ice cream and turned to the ring leader and said - "you are only saying that because you want to kiss me - well you can kiss my ass - you are not even in my league" I had to stifle a laugh - I have no idea where he gets his confidence from (btw he was right - but I would say that!!).
All the best to you and your wee ones.
Annie - I'd definitely keep on at the school to try and get things sorted out. Bullying's a big problem these days. I don't think it does any good to tell children to strike out at others, or even to think of some quick retorts, because this can result in very insulting or offensive things being thrown about. I don't think there's anything worse than hearing young children swear and trying to be "clever". Taunts are best ignored.
If you can speak to this boy's mother, I think it's best to do so - in a calm manner. Tell her that you've reported her child for...and explain why. Then report any further bullying to the head teacher. Best of luck.
If you can speak to this boy's mother, I think it's best to do so - in a calm manner. Tell her that you've reported her child for...and explain why. Then report any further bullying to the head teacher. Best of luck.
Hi guys - i sent him off to school this morning with a letter for the teacher - explaining what was happening, asking for a meeting and letting them know that it is totally unacceptable for my son to be unable to attend school without fear, threat, worry and physical violence. I'm with you ice, if it is not sorted I am happy to go to the press. I know of at least 2 children who have moved from the school because of bullying. This doesn't paint a very good picture, but it is honestly a really nice school this problem excepted.
Hi again annie,
Luckily my two are naturally confident. They are mad that it's happening, especially of course the one that is getting the brunt of it but they are able to say ' He's just a nasty little coward and I'm better than him' I know not all children have that confidence, glad your boys do.
Up until my daughters were involved with this I was firmly of the 'hitting back does no good, tell a teacher' brigade but now Ive changed my mind. This boy, in front of the playground helper, has several times walked over to my girl and kicked or punched her while she's standing with her friends. A bully report gets filled in, he gets sent to the Head and told he's not getting his Good Behaviour sticker for that morning! The mum is of the ' That's not very nice, please say sorry because we've had a little chat about punching people before' ineffectual type.
In other words nobody is doing anything about this boy.
Ice - what action did the school take when you said you would go to the Press? Was the child excluded from the school? This is an option I hadn't thought of but it's worth looking into.
Luckily my two are naturally confident. They are mad that it's happening, especially of course the one that is getting the brunt of it but they are able to say ' He's just a nasty little coward and I'm better than him' I know not all children have that confidence, glad your boys do.
Up until my daughters were involved with this I was firmly of the 'hitting back does no good, tell a teacher' brigade but now Ive changed my mind. This boy, in front of the playground helper, has several times walked over to my girl and kicked or punched her while she's standing with her friends. A bully report gets filled in, he gets sent to the Head and told he's not getting his Good Behaviour sticker for that morning! The mum is of the ' That's not very nice, please say sorry because we've had a little chat about punching people before' ineffectual type.
In other words nobody is doing anything about this boy.
Ice - what action did the school take when you said you would go to the Press? Was the child excluded from the school? This is an option I hadn't thought of but it's worth looking into.
Hi ying yang, my younger son is very confident, but the one that is getting bullied isn't and never has been. Needless to say that this is not helping!
Have you tried speaking to the Dad instead, or is there not one on the scene?
I thought about getting into conversation with the boys Mum and say that I am dealing with the school because Craig is being bullied and tell her some of the things that have been happening and then when she she says how terrible it is and do I know who is doing it, I can say actually it is your son and she can't then say that it is not a problem.
I do tend to think that a good dose of the belt like we used to get when we were at school would sort it out. As my oh said, kids have short memories for being talked to or losing a privilidge, but you always remember the sting of the belt and it is a good deterent.......and while we are at it bring back hanging!!!
Have you tried speaking to the Dad instead, or is there not one on the scene?
I thought about getting into conversation with the boys Mum and say that I am dealing with the school because Craig is being bullied and tell her some of the things that have been happening and then when she she says how terrible it is and do I know who is doing it, I can say actually it is your son and she can't then say that it is not a problem.
I do tend to think that a good dose of the belt like we used to get when we were at school would sort it out. As my oh said, kids have short memories for being talked to or losing a privilidge, but you always remember the sting of the belt and it is a good deterent.......and while we are at it bring back hanging!!!
with the way bullying is portrayed in the media etc its a hot topic for LEA's, therefore if you have approached the headteacher before regarding this then go back to them explain what is happening and that whatever action the headteacher took previously hadn't worked and you expect it to stop or you will be taking the matter further,
tell him/her that you will be contacting the governors, your councillor, LEA and also local papers regarding the issue and the schools distinct lack of interest in solving the problem
This should make the headteacher take action if only to save their job
tell him/her that you will be contacting the governors, your councillor, LEA and also local papers regarding the issue and the schools distinct lack of interest in solving the problem
This should make the headteacher take action if only to save their job
Thanks danchip - It was the class teacher I spoke with before, but I have asked to speak to the Head teacher as well this time. I have spoken to the Head Teacher before about a completely unrelated matter and it took her about 3 months to officially respond with what was basically a fob off, so i am not holding out too much hope, but I will give her the opportunity to deal with it but I am quite prepared to take it further and I will leave her in no doubt that I am.
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