Listener crossword 4071

[starwalker]

This week's offering is "Five Dots" by Franc, which feels somewhat reminiscent of one or two of his previous puzzles.
More difficult than some of the recent offerings, but sound and unambiguous once the theme is established.

[jacinth]

Indeed - I was wondering whether I should tell you that. I made the same mistake and my stubbornness ruled for well over an hour. Very glad you worked it out!

[silversolver]

I enjoyed this one and agree that the way the dots revealed themselves at the end was very satisfying. I held myself up for a while with an incorrect answer to 51 ac (in fact the exact reverse of the correct answer!)

[Ottorino]

I think I made the same mistake as Silversolver and had the same doubts as others on the scottish reference. I'm looking to replace an old Chambers Thesaurus which is falling apart under the weight of more than 10,000 words I've added over 17 years of Listeners and 7 of Magpies. Amazon offers both dictionary and list for Bradford. Any advice as to which is better?

[x_word_fan]

Ottorino

Re. Bradfords - I have both but rarely use the lists - there are other cheaper list books that are better set out in my opinion. The dictionary however is indispensable.

[Ottorino]

Thanks for that, x_word_fan. Anything that can save me a few hours a week will help me to get back a life in addition to the exquisite grind of our strange hobby!

[catstail]

I have chambers lists and crossword dictionary. Since getting the dictionary I haven't used the lists. I haven't seen Bradfords so I don't know they compare but chambers certainly has some v obscure words.
(Would be interested to hear re Bradfords v Chambers xword dict. Do they complement each other or make each other redundant?)

[milford15]

I really enjoyed this but found it a lot more difficult than recent weeks. I was held up by not understanding the meaning of "Numbers in brackets give the numbers of cells used for the grid " i.e. assumed the clashes were single letters! Once I realized my mistake, things got a bit easier. Not sure of some of the wordplays, and thus do not have the full "common version of a thematic statement attributed to a name" but have all the entities now. Thanks to all, and many congratulations to those who finished so quickly - I am awestruck at your brilliance.

[daagg]

milford, if you have completed the grid, you should be able to find the author's name across the middle. If you google "<name> quotations", the first entry has the puzzle's quotation as it's second item - hope that makes sense.

[Archie1962]

Once you have about half the clues you should have an idea of at least a few consecutive words of the quotation. Google that and you have your name and the full quotation. That tells you what all the extra words are, which should help a bit with the remaining clues.

The space at the bottom is a bit small for the five entities.

[milford15]

Thanks daagg and archie - that has helped a lot - good to know all the extra words now to try and work out all the wordplays. Many thanks. Looking forward to next week now. Definitely addicted now!

[wuneyedjack]

Just finished the puzzle and get all the wordplay except 40ac - am I being dense?

[midazolam]

answer = ?????
jolly = ????**?
** = out of bed

[wuneyedjack]

Thanks midazolam - I should've seen it as there were plenty of tougher clues. Guess the brain doesn't work so hard when it knows you've got the answer pencilled in.

[Mysterons]

Enjoyed this one a lot, and especially liked the preamble's hint about the nature of the grid, along with the complete lack of bars (wot, no Galaxy, Mars or Milky Way ?)
I did wonder why the preamble referred to 'the final dot' - as the central cell is completely unclued this dot's location can be deduced much earlier than the others.

[milford15]

Can someone explain the wordplay to 49D please? i have the answer, know the extra word, and all letters are checked. Does 'block' indicate 'cease'? Why 'limestone'? Thanks

[Scorpius]

Milford15, 49d is a case of an indirect hidden word (very obscure). If you imagine your grid answer surrounded by a pair of letters, a bit of searching in Chambers should reveal the precise wordplay.

I think it's a great pity that on another thread on this puzzle, the answer to a clue (16a) was given outright. It was another tricky clue, but with a bit of thought, a bit searching, the answer should be apparent. All that was needed was a prompt, not the outright answer. What's the point of completing a puzzle having been told an answer? It's far more satisfying to work it out for oneself. Moreover, just giving the answer doesn't really help the recipient to develop their solving strategies.

[catstail]

Milford15: There is a single word which means the same as the last two words in the clue, and this single word has a hidden answer. This single word is not in Chambers Xword dictionary. However, going through Chambers methodically will soon lead to it.

Have now got the quote, author and possibly theme. Haven't filled in the grid totally but will plod on. I agree that the fifth dot was easy. I just wish the others were. Still haven't got the references to dots being "within 10 degrees", so I might have the wrong theme. Only one more week before the answer is revealed!

[milford15]

Thanks, catstail, all is now clear.

[wuneyedjack]

catstail - i was at the same stage as you, left with at least one clue where a possible solution suggested itself but the space was too short. it clicked when i looked at the letters i'd filled from crossing entries and what was left of the word i wanted to fit. if you've got the fifth dot, it's a small mental step to completion.

[catstail]

Thanks for the encouragement Wuneyedjack.