The Old School Tie

[Booldawg]

Even in todays society are there certain career paths/professions that are still a closed shop to someone from a comprehensive school education?

I guess that barristers, top investment banks etc is a case of not what you know but who you know.

[DTCwordfan]

I would argue that it is wider than just public schools - it's how the sales world works as well.....and it even happens at working level - "me car is fecked, anyone know a brilliant mechanic?" or my immersion tank is leaking - what do I do, anyone know a reasonable plumber.

It's what AB is for in part...........

[FredPuli43]

Well you are wrong about barristers, for a start. Having proven academic ability and showing strength in the skills essential to the Bar are what matters. Those characteristics are what any pupil-master or interviewing panel are looking for, right from the outset.

[237SJ]

No, that`s not true. My friend`s husband went to a comprehensive school and he is doing quite well now in aviation insurance and taking home £11,000 per month.

[Canary42]

Remind me again, what percentage of the Cabinet went to Eton ?

[DTCwordfan]

Try the Newcastle Circuit of Judges Fred, 7 out of the current 12 went to Sedbergh......

[FredPuli43]

Yes, but look when they started their careers DTC. I'm talking about now. They presumably opted for the North East because they had local knowledge and connections with solicitors and members of chambers who practised in the North East

[Barmaid]

I disagree. I went to the Bar later in life so my earlier education was less important. Just as well really. ;)

I didn't get to where I am by who I know. I got there through having a first class law degree and coming top of my year in bar finals. I don't do run of the mill stuff either. Someone I supported through his pupillage and is now one of the best advocates of his generation went to a terrible school. The law IS open to those with ability and talent.

[DTCwordfan]

So how do you explain the NE circuit, Barmaid?

Yes, they were born in the area, but all from the same (good) school...coincidence or meritocracy?

[DTCwordfan]

And seven - their school mag was very proud of that photo.

[Barmaid]

Perhaps it wasn't the school they went to, perhaps it was their ability DT. Perhaps they went to that school because of their ability, who knows.

Fact is, the Bar is open to those who have ability, promise and a hard work ethic. I only have to look at the demographic make up of my own chambers to see that amongst the more junior end there is a much more eclectic mix.

[adrianben]

You are correct in your statement of its "not what you know but who you know." but when you are who they want to know then you've cracked it !

[DTCwordfan]

I'm pleased to hear that, Barmaid...but in the shires, perhaps nepotism is still practised. Seven out of twelve, when you have so many top private and grammar schools around, never mind the State system.....I admit that I haven't looked at the Uni qualifications but I'll bet that it limited to Oxbridge and Durham....

[DTCwordfan]

I did find this in my trawl for the picture, Barmaid. Thought that you would appreciate it:

http://www.lawbriefupdate.com/cartoons/qccartoon83.jpg

[Barmaid]

lol. If you are reduced to arguing HR, you really are scraping the bottom of the barrel. That did make me laugh.

[DTCwordfan]

Mate of mine is a top International HR lawyer and does very nicely......not Qatada's (lol)....handles mainly the Indian sub-con.

[FredPuli43]

Back in 69, when I started, there was a chambers that took, as members, only Balliol men who had a first in law . I only know this because they took a friend of mine who had a first from Cambridge, and this did only after much soul searching before allowing such a break from tradition; good heavens, the fellow isn't even an Oxonian!. Had he been a she, they would certainly not have taken such a candidate, Balliol or not.

Remember too, that starting at the Bar then invariably needed some financial support because you'd be living on what you earned and that was sometimes scant and always late in being paid. Significantly, it was the highest earning sets in commercial, tax, and Chancery (yes, Barmaid, don't laugh) that were first to offer what amounted to a salary from chambers funds to help youngsters when they started.

[FredPuli43]

On the law and the facts being against you, they never are. There's always something you can latch on to, however unpromising. That's where the fun starts; selling the unsaleable should be counsel's stock in trade. The Court of Appeal exists to make decisions which are either contrary to, or distinguishable in some imperceptible way, from what the Court of Appeal has said before. The trick is to get there. And, at the lower level, it's surprising what can be achieved by careful assessment of the prejudices and biases of the particular forum.

[Booldawg]

thanks all for the input. It does seem that most careers are open to all. I remember speaking to a mate who's a carpet fitter. One of his colleagues used to be an airline pilot but gave it up due to how much it cost a year to keep up with the re-certs, additional training and various other costs per year. He could earn more fitting carpets. A bit off tangent but you seem to have to buy your job these days.

[emmie]

i think that if you are determined there isn't any job you can't do.