Does Faith equal Ignorance?

[MWB]

The put down of intelligence and use of the mind in any way is so woven throughout the New Testament that one must finally conclude that people should strive to be stupid and unquestioning, and that those who are not are doomed.

"For it is written, I will destroy the wisdom of the wise, and will bring to nothing the understanding of the prudent." I Cor 1:19

"It pleased God by the foolishness of preaching to save them that believe." I Cor 1:21

Plagiarised from a "Doubting Thomas" website. I'm sure they won't mind.

[Octavius]

Paul was quoting Isaiah and in context referred to the �wisdom� of the policies created and enforced under the king�s administration by the political elite. He was challenging the wisdom of authority rule.

Like today, we talk of daft government policies and �bonkers� government officials creating bonkers laws, it is of a similar vein.

[USALady]

Those who are not Christian take most scripture out of context. Why do you try to discredit the Bible so intensely if you are an atheist? What do you care?

[pinktwink]

i agree usa lady why have you such contempt for the bible for someone who doesnt agree with the teachings you know and post a lot about it

[naomi24]

Does faith equal ignorance? Sometimes, yes, but more often it equals denial. People of faith are very often well aware of the inconsistencies - and the horrors - recorded in their religious texts, but they prefer not to think about that. It would muddy the rose-coloured spectacles.

USALady, why do we care? Because religion affects non-believers - hence, they are perfectly entitled to care.

pinktwink, yes, we do know a lot about it - in some instances, far more than those who believe - which is why we don't.

[WaldoMcFroog]

Yes, foolish non-Christians who don't even know the Bible.

Everyone knows you actually need to look to Genesis 2:15 (the admonition not to eat from the tree of knowledge of Good and Evil) and Genesis 11:6 (God cacks his pants because humans with knowledge are dangerous) to see where God takes steps to stop human beings gaining knowledge, explicitly stating that if they get it, "nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do".

[HatlessJack]

Some marvellous imagery, there, Waldo..........to kick start the week :oD

[naomi24]

^^ Absolutely!

[Davethedog]

USALady explain then. If MWB is misquoting or taking things out of context show us where he is wrong.

Its eeasy to say hes wrong, but it looks ok to me.

[jake-the-peg]

We athiests care because we are have had the bible quoted at us so many times!

Christians are forever telling us to read the bible and find the amazing truths there.

Of course when we do what do we find?

A lot of self contradictory mumbo jumbo!

Question it and you get told "You're taking it out of context" and the twisting and turning starts

Actually MWB it's an interesting question when seen in the context of the Gnostics. An early pseudoChristian sect that saw salvation as coming through the revelation of sacred knowledge.

In that sense knowledge was power and elitist - consequently mainstream Christianity which required no knowledge or skills or even intelligence but just blind faith was more accessible to more people and grew whereas gnosticism died.

In short Big Brother gets a bigger audience than Newsnight!

[B-BOY]

Faith - noun
belief that is not based on proof

Ignorance - noun
lack of knowledge

proof - noun
evidence sufficient to establish a thing as true, or to produce belief in its truth

ergo ........religious faith is belief in a God despite insufficient evidence to prove his existance (lack of knowledge - ignorance)

[B-BOY]

Before I get pulled up by the spelling Nazi's, excuse my own ignorance....should have been spelt "existence"

[Octavius]

I don�t think I was telling MWB that they were taking it out of context. In my post, I was saying that he [Paul] was doing what we do today with our own politicians, think tanks, public inquiries etc.

If a politician in a place of authority comes up with a ridiculous manifesto or proposal, we would all lambaste the �wisdom� of this person and question their credibility. Sometimes people would call for their resignation. That doesn�t automatically make us ignorant does it.

[jake-the-peg]

No but USALady was

You'll see from her post a somewhat typical response from some particular types of Christianity.

Non believers tend to quote the Bible out of context.

Which is pretty damn close to saying if you don't support our particular view of the world you are by definition wrong

[Octavius]

Well that was a generalisation about scripture, and in this instance it seems MWB is inferring something else from a different perspective. Of course elsewhere in the Bible he may well be right, but not in this one.

So the question has evolved then to a scripture context/word twisting religious/atheist spat has it? So does faith make people ignorant?

[keyplus90]

If she says that it is quoted out of context then why don�t you give her a chance to put it right and explain it with the context. By not asking her, and then if she is willing to tell then by not listening to her and after you listened to her and it does make some sort of sense, then by not agreeing to her. You are doing the same thing what you are blaming others of.

[keyplus90]

I would love to myself with context that bible tells us (I can find ref if needed, well done google) that when a woman gives a birth to a boy she stays unclean for 40 days and when she gives a birth to a girl then 80 days. Why double with the girl?

[Octavius]

Keyplus, not sure, but I think that is Leviticus and comes from Babylonian culture. In ancient times sons (male heirs) were regarded more favourably than daughters. The woman was called �unclean� because she is menstruating - ancient cultures had little regard for the female other than to reproduce and look after the men/tribe. Furthermore, the Babylonian rules, superstitions or culture, determined that a born female would take longer to be cleansed (nice I know, but that�s the ancients for you) and that any man who dabbled with her during this time would most likely be born another daughter. So they left it longer to increase the chances of male born.

[naomi24]

Keyplus, you already know quite a bit about antiquated beliefs, since in Islam, menstruating women are still seen as unclean.

http://www.questionsonislam.com/subpage.php?s= article&aid=9928

Love the bit where a husband is advised to avoid touching his wife anywhere between the navel and the knees! How funny!

This page also says 'In some women the bleeding never stops'. I would have thought that rather than continuing to give advice on prayers and ritual cleansing, the author would have had the common sense to advise women, in those circumstances, to seek urgent medical help. It seems, at times, faith does indeed equal the most appalling ignorance.

[HatlessJack]

I think it is the slavish adherence to faith and the unwillingness to consider anything 'outside the box' of that faith for fear of being seen to question the ultimate truths and revelations that contributes to 'ignorance'.

Blinkered acceptance of any faith or belief system condems the devotee to 'ignorance'.