EAO Everton123

[denis567]

Did you see in today's Daily Express about the release of a new book by Frank Dikotter called 'Mao's Great Famine'?
The headline is 'Mao the Mass Murderer' then it goes on to say that for the first time a historian has shown how China's communist ruler killed 45 million of his people in the world's biggest man made famine.
Apparently new laws now permit access to the archives of the Chinese Communist Party, but my point is that most of these accusations were made in 2005 with the publication of Jung Chan's 'Mao, The Unknown Story'.
I wonder what your opinion is, mindful of your Chinese connections.

[123everton]

Hi Denis, I was unaware of the book although I am aware of the famine.
That's an enormous figure, I can't even envisage such a tragedy.
The common Chinese answer when faced with Mao is "how do you build a country?"
If you look at the Irish famine of 1845 to 1852 then you'd see a country in the 100 years after it very little changed, Ireland only really altered with the E.U money, China's had wars since the famine (2 off the top of my head) plus the cutural revolution.
The trial of the gang of four (1981?) drew a line under the Maoist doctrines.
Mao will always be revered by the Chinese peasant classes because he freed them from the land lords and feudalism.
Mao, certainly in the west, is a divisive figure, even I can't quite make my mind up about his tenure, but as for his legacy.....
What's your opinion?

[denis567]

Hi 123everton. I have only had an interest in Chinese history since I picked up a copy of 'Mao, The Unknown Story' at a Church bazaar a couple of years ago. I found it fascinating reading and as it was extremely anti-Mao my opinions of him were formed at that stage, that he was a cruel, scheming tyrant. Since then I have read quite a few related books, many of them suggested by yourself (Xinran etc.) and they have all re-enforced my views.
It seems unthinkable a few years ago, that the communist party would agree to allow access to their archives of the Mao period, it just shows how China has changed over the past 20 - 30 years. I bet your wife cannot believe it!!
The book mentioned is £25, so it will have to go on my Christmas wish list.

[jno]

£16 here

http://www.amazon.co....qid=1283552878&sr=1-1

they'll probably be giving it away by Christmas. (We got a half-price copy of Blair's memoirs yesterday, don't ask me why, wasn't my idea.)

I suppose there's an argument that a similar percentage of, say, England's population has been wiped out in events like the Wars of the Roses - I'm just guessing, I don't know the actual figures. But that's hardly a justification.

[denis567]

Thanks for your input, jno, I shall buy it from Amazon

[123everton]

There's different aspects to Mao, he did retain China as a sovreign country not a Russian or American vassel state, Chang Kai Shek left the country penniless it was their year zero, there was no Marshall Plan for China.
The Chinese can be very pragmatic, oddly so, read John Rabe's book and focus on the aftermath in Nanking.
The famine is something that happened, and now it's over, the Chinese seem to focus forward rather than backward.
I feel also it has to be considered that famine was not unusual in China at the time, there was a large famine around the time of The Second Sino Japanese War.

[BertiWooster]

//(We got a half-price copy of Blair's memoirs yesterday, don't ask me why, wasn't my idea.) //

It's ok jno - if you want to buy a copy of the book , that's fine , it's your prerogative - no need to apologise ( wink )

[jno]

<hurls John Prescott autobiography at Berti>