norman kember..

[mullein3]

I know its been said before but i feel so sorry for that hostage norman kember..its the deadline today..and i dont personally hold out any hope for the man..its just ken bigley all over again..they make demands they know are not going to be met. to justify the murder of innocent victims..I know lots of you will say he shouldnt have gone in the first place..but he did and he is only their as someone to help the iraqs i dont think he is making mega money ..if any at all..I personally think we should withdraw our troops and let them sort themselves out..

[Drusilla]

It is sad and I wish him well.
I think one of the problems I haven't seen mentioned before is Islam's strictness with missionaries of other faiths trying to convert Moslems. I don't believe it justifies the actions of the thugs that have captured the man, but it gives them a faith based argument to play with a man's life. It's very sad.
My neighbours' and my parents' neighbours are Moslems and they have been the best neighbours one could ask for; neighbourly in the traditional sense that seems to have been lost to most of us white, English suburbanites.
What I would like to know is, what happened to the hunt for Osama bin Laden?? Is it ongoing, or forgotten?? I really don't know! Anyone know??

[coyn]

I feel for the man and his family but I can never understand why anyone would be stupid enough to go there.

[Chessman]

I agree fully with all the above posts, but the real problem, no matter how good the intentions, is a bit of thought before acting, all these people think it won't happen to them, because they are men and women of peace, but it does, so maybe any other do-gooders, (and its meant in the best way). will think first.

[Drisgirl]

Ditto - coyn.

I so feel for him but he not only put his own life at risk by this futile attempt at peace but he also did not give consideration to his own family.

[loudickson71]

i kinda hold hope. maybe the pressure and speeches will make a diff. what a bunch of total scum if they kill him now. I mean, it's bad enough, but with all sides saying 'release him'...I would execute the type of people that did this, I really would. I think they just like killing folk. Don't care who it is. 'We are oppressed....kill someone'. The geezer was over there working for them, for god's sake. What a bunch of ********.

[Oneeyedvic]

Personally, I don't see any similarity with Ken Bigley - I do actually feel for Norman Kember as he is out there on a peace mission - Ken Bigley was there to make money.

That said (and also being against the war) I don''t think that Blair should give into terrorist threats about killing hostages.

[Andy008]

Thnaks. And the question is?

[Oneeyedvic]

Obviously as an avid Sun reader, I appreciate you probably don't understand that not all questions have question marks at the end.

Everyone else seems to have taken the 'reasonable' assumption that mullein3 would like other people's views on this matter.

Best stick to looking at lesbians if I were you, rather than 'news' topics.

[tobeloy]

If blair or bush or one of the people who hold a position in government office were on a visit out there and they were kidnapped would the official line still be" we do not negotiate with terrorists" I dont think so

[mullein3]

andy008...i know its not a question and i am surprised someone hasnt posted about it before me..it is news though and my heart sinks every time i see the poor man in shackles...and i still feel sorry for ken bigley every time i hear his name ..i know he was earning big money but so what!! he didnt deserve to die..he was also innocent..

[coyn]

Why does everyone equate Ken Bigley's wages with whether or not his hideous murder was justified FFS.

The people who committed this barbaric act should be slaughtered like the animals they are.

What the f*** is wrong with people in this country?

[mullein3]

coyn exactly we have iraq people working in this country for big wages and no one tells them to go home..money shouldnt come into it when innocent people are being murdered in barbaric ways..its not safe for people to go to iraq but they go probably thinking it will never happen to them they take the risk..and they seem to have started taking hostages again to bring attention to them selves..why the good people of the uk try to help them i will never know..we should leave them to it...

[Oneeyedvic]

Yes Bigley was innocent - but my point is that he went there for one reason and one resaon only - to make money from working in a war torn country. The wages you can earn there are far more than you can earn here - and why - because there is a very high risk that you might die.

Norman Kember did not go out there to earn money - he went on a peace trip as he was opposed to the war.

[luckyboy]

How do you know bigley was there just to make money, maybe he also went there thinking he was helping to contribute to rebuilding a new iraq, a point lost on the terrorists most of which are not even iraqi, just a thought.

I know its not in keeping with many contributions on this site, it, [not getting at you honest ] not being a cynical and negative comment, but maybe its not far from the truth.

[Oneeyedvic]

You are of course correct - I don't know Ken Bigley - all my views are based on certain assumptions - and they are as follows:

1. He was wroking for a company called Gulf Supplies and General Services


2. He told his neighbours that he was planing to retire in Thailand with his (Thai) wife


3. I can find nothing on the news sites regarding any form of charity work or peace missions that he conducted.

As I said, I am basing a lot of my opinion on assumptions, and am willing to change my views about it if it can be shown that he was there to 'help the Iraqi people' and not to line his own pockets.

[luckyboy]

But again, those assumptions are just that aren't they assumptions, obviously the main reason was earning a living but he may have had some sort of naive personal view that at the same time he was helping to rebuild the country..nobody knows. and i take your point about him knowing the risks but then norman kember knew the risks regardless of his peace activism, after all look what happened to margaret hassan, who plainly was not there to make money..

[Oneeyedvic]

I know where you are coming from luckboy - I can't say I have any answers.

The best analagy I can give is a s follows: If I were to speed along the M1 at 3am with little traffic about at 100mph, not a lot of people would have sympathy if I lost my licene. If I was doing the same but had a liver that was to be in hospital the following day for a transplant, people would be more sympathetic.

One is a selfish motive, the other is for others. I believe that KB was out there for selfish reasons - NK for unselfish ones - yes both knew the risks (maybe even moreso NK) but it is the reason behind it that makes me more sympathetic to one of them.

[luckyboy]

Fair enough vic, not having a go at you personally,

just me playing devils advocate.

[gaza47]

its a sad fact that a lot of people get killed in a war, soldiers dont have a choice they took the shilling and go where they are told,the Norman Kembers and Ken Biggleys of this world had a choice they dident have to go to a very dangerous place where western workers have been kidnaped and killed, its sad but they only have themselves to blame, I hope for the sake of his family mr. Kember is released, but even if he is human greed will not stop others following for the big pay or on futile mersy missions