Car Accident - No Licence Or Insurance

[Cheshire123]

My friend took his wife's lease car and crashed it he's uninsured and unlicensed. He has had previous convictions for driving without a license but nothing in the last 8 years. He's not driven in that time.
He's very depressed and she believe that it was down to how low he is.
They have been to the police twice now to admit it/deal with it ( first visit was an hour after the crash) but the police just keep telling them they'd come out to see them at home. It's been 5 days since the crash and no police contact.
They have offered to pay for the third parties car but he has declined stating that he wants to go through insurance even though he knows my friend is uninsured. They have started to fix their own car.
I'm just wondering what sort of punishment he will face as they are both beside themselves with worry,
They are seeing a solicitor in the next couple of days. Also before I suggest it would it be worth my friend sitting his driving test now to show that he's put steps in place to make sure he can never be in this position again?

[themas]

If he's very depressed & caused an accident (you make it clear it was his fault) the first time (I assume) he has driven for many years then would he pass the test without lessons to bring his knowledge & skill up to date? More importantly, should he be driving in his present depressed condition? The driving licence application form, if I remember rightly, asks a lot of health questions which might mean he would have to provide medical evidence of his capacity. His GP should be asked for advice on his fitness to drive.

[boxtops]

If he had a licence but no insurance, it looks as if he could be fined £300 and 6 points on his licence. Your friend has no licence. This suggests he could be in for a "severe penalty" http://www.findlaw.co.uk/law/motoring/vehicle_crime/500277.html

I don't think starting to take his driving test just at this point would help very much. Best take proper legal advice.

[gingejbee]

He may well be depressed, but presumably was well aware of his own lack of insurance and licence before he drove off in somebody else's car?
Surely that's the bones of the argument?

[New Judge]

Your friend’s offence is aggravated by the fact that (a) he caused an accident and (b) he has never passed a test. The police should not offer a fixed penalty for these offences and instead take the matter to a prosecution.

It is likely he will be fined about a week and a half’s net income for the insurance offence and half a week’s income for the licence offence. Both fines will be reduced by a third if he pleads guilty. He will receive a minimum of six points though the Bench may see fit to impose more (maximum is 8), or even impose a disqualification, due to the aggravating features. He will also pay prosecution costs (about £85 for a guilty plea), a Victim Surcharge (10% of the highest of the two fines) and, If the offence was committed on or after 13th April, a “Criminal Court Charge” of £150.

Your friend’s and his wife should also be prepared for the police to consider one of two other possibilities. They may either (a) charge your friend with taking the vehicle without consent (if he admits to doing so) or (b) charging his wife with permitting his offences to be committed (if she admits giving him such permission).

[Cheshire123]

Thanks to all. I'm a novice but want to support as much as possible. If he's also charged with taking the car without consent what's the penalty for that? They are both really worried that he may get a prison sentence for it. He's not a mentally well man and I'm not sure he could cope with that

[Zzxyn]

Sounds as though your friend who took his wife's car and crashed it, has some very serious mental aberrations. It is presumes that he is aware that it is necessary to have a drivers licence and car insurance BEFORE being allowed to drive ? If so, what the Hell was he doing by attempting to drive, or does he think that for some reason he is an exception ?
Sorry to be unsympathetic regarding this but its time this uninsured driver had his knuckles very severely rapped as he could easily have killed someone.
Sorry, no sympathy with stupidity.

[Buenchico]

Somewhat surprisingly, although driving while banned can lead to a prison sentence, driving without a licence can't. So, as long as your friend isn't still subject to a driving ban from his offence 8 years ago (which would seem to be extremely unlikely) he can't be sent to prison for driving with no licence.

Driving without insurance also can't lead to a prison sentence.

Taking a vehicle without consent does carry a possible prison sentence (of up to 6 months) but such a sentence would normally be reserved for (say) repeat joy-riders and would not be imposed upon someone taking a vehicle from a family member.

Your friend won't go to prison.

[Peter Pedant]

The elephant in the room is that your friend is depressed and needs help.

In his depressed state he is doing things which may affect / damage other people and he needs proper help - fast ! yeah yeah I know this is a legal column

[SeaJayPea]

One other thing - this isn't his wife's car, it belongs to a leasing company. They need to be told that it's been involved in an accident. It's theirs after all. They will have the right to insist that it is repaired to their satisfaction. If it isn't done properly, then at the end of the lease somebody could be looking at a massive bill.

[Hypognosis]

@Cheshire123

Just to put us in the picture, can you let us know which of the following sequences is correct?

Depression diagnosis
Offence of 8 years ago
7+ years' normality (or ups & downs)
Recent offence

Offence of 8 years ago
7+ years' normality (or ups & downs)
Depression diagnosis
Recent offence

Offence of 8 years ago
7+ years' normality (or ups & downs)
Recent offence
Depression diagnosis

The problem with trying to use a medical condition to mitigate an offence is that consent to give the court access to his medically-confidential notes must be given. This can lead to a catch-22 situation, whereby, if he was sectioned, (eg strong risk of harm to himself or others) he might be deemed unfit to give *informed* consent, of this kind.

People ate permitted to drive with depression but it is one of those conditions which needs to be notified to the DVLA and non-disclosure to his insurer could easily have led to invalidation of his claim.

If the medication says "do not drive or operate machinery", ignoring that would be negligence. Luckily, it didn't get as far as someone getting killed.

[Hypognosis]

*People are permitted to…

(bloomin' phone keypad!)

[New Judge]

There's no particular need for the court to go into that level of depth, Hypo.

If Cheshire's friend's husband pleads guilty (which it seems he will) the Magistrates will hear his mitigation (either from his brief or himself if he is not represented) and this can include all the factors mentioned. However it is unlikely to have a significant influence on the sentence. Having depression does not mitigate these offences. It may help explain why they were committed (though in this instance it is hard to see how) but it does not make them less serious. The Bench will take at face value what they hear (unless they have strong reasons to disbelieve any of it). Citing a medical problem does not automatically create the need for the court to access medical records and the court is unlikely to seek to do so. These are comparitively minor offences and the Magistrates will simply proceed to sentence, probably along the lines i have mentioned.

[ummmm]

My sister had a crash while driving without a license. The car was insured but obviously not for her to drive.

The police were called to the scene and she admitted not having a license.

Nothing happened. She heard nothing back from the police.

[Hypognosis]

That's reassuring, NJ. My chief concern was that it _could_ be used in mitigation, which would only increase its use as an excuse, which would only serve to further undermine the seriousness with which people take the condition. I haven't had it for many years but it still grates with me when people use the word in the colloquial sense of "feeling down". At its worst, I could barely get on my feet, let alone drive a car.

If the offender had made a serious attempt to kill himself, using the car, then it wouldn't so much mitigate the offence as get him sectioned, presumably? Not much chance of getting a licence with that on your medical history, I dare say.

[Cheshire123]

Thanks to all. I'm a novice but want to support as much as possible. If he's also charged with taking the car without consent what's the penalty for that? They are both really worried that he may get a prison sentence for it. He's not a mentally well man and I'm not sure he could cope with that

[Buenchico]

>>>If he's also charged with taking the car without consent what's the penalty for that

As I wrote above:
"Taking a vehicle without consent does carry a possible prison sentence (of up to 6 months) but such a sentence would normally be reserved for (say) repeat joy-riders and would not be imposed upon someone taking a vehicle from a family member.

Your friend won't go to prison."

To read exactly what the magistrates would be required to refer to, see page 110 here:
http://www.sentencingcouncil.org.uk/wp-content/uploads/MCSG_web_-_October_2014.pdf
You'll see that, in the circumstances you describe, a prison sentence can NOT be passed. If the offence was seen as being at the very lowest level he could just be fined. Otherwise a Community Order would be imposed.