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Speed Cameras.....
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Why do people spout such venom about speed cameras. I doubt that any critic of them would feel charitable if one of their loved ones were killed by a speeding motorist. Hypocritical
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" But are they really the "stasi" because they use hand-held speed cameras on the side of the road. What a childish thing to say ! "
Mikey - not the police - who (by and large) only carry out speed camera/gun checks at actual danger points.
My comments are aimed firmly at the unaccountable jobsworths of the local 'safety camera partnerships' - employed on performance related pay to maximise revenue. They have codes of conduct which they ignore/subvert at every opportunity. Nothing is about road safety, everything is about money.
Mikey - not the police - who (by and large) only carry out speed camera/gun checks at actual danger points.
My comments are aimed firmly at the unaccountable jobsworths of the local 'safety camera partnerships' - employed on performance related pay to maximise revenue. They have codes of conduct which they ignore/subvert at every opportunity. Nothing is about road safety, everything is about money.
I haven't read all the posts so may have missed....are hand held at the road side supposed to be visible at all?
On the road to Leicester there is a wooded layby where the speed limit suddenly lowers after a bend.....it was an oft frequented spot for unseen officers to catch those not quick enough to reduce from fifty to forty....
On the road to Leicester there is a wooded layby where the speed limit suddenly lowers after a bend.....it was an oft frequented spot for unseen officers to catch those not quick enough to reduce from fifty to forty....
Whenever Speed Cameras are discussed - this link always raises a few eyebrows about whether the cameras are cash cows or not.
http://
http://
“Has anyone on here that has been done for speeding ever asked, has the speed gun / or any other device been calibrated, & when also the paper work to show…”
Well, if they have, TWR, they will probably tell anybody else considering doing so not to bother. It is an urban myth which says all you have to do is to ask for this information and the prosecution will go away. It won’t, and you should remember this:
The information will not be routinely provided and will certainly not be available to enable the driver to decide whether or not to accept a Fixed Penalty Offer. He will have to opt for a court appearance where he will have to plead Not Guilty. If he is to use the “inadequately calibrated machine” as his defence the onus will fall on him to cast sufficient doubt in the Magistrates’ minds so that they cannot be sure of the machine’s accuracy. More than this, to avoid conviction he will have to convince them that the machine is so inaccurate that, not only did it record the speed inaccurately but that it did so to such a degree that there is doubt that the speed limit was exceeded at all. (e.g. if the speed alleged is 85mph he will have to demonstrate sufficient doubt that it was out by 15mph). There is no statutory requirement to calibrate speed guns or cameras at any particular intervals and the defence, such that it is, is rarely successful.
Well, if they have, TWR, they will probably tell anybody else considering doing so not to bother. It is an urban myth which says all you have to do is to ask for this information and the prosecution will go away. It won’t, and you should remember this:
The information will not be routinely provided and will certainly not be available to enable the driver to decide whether or not to accept a Fixed Penalty Offer. He will have to opt for a court appearance where he will have to plead Not Guilty. If he is to use the “inadequately calibrated machine” as his defence the onus will fall on him to cast sufficient doubt in the Magistrates’ minds so that they cannot be sure of the machine’s accuracy. More than this, to avoid conviction he will have to convince them that the machine is so inaccurate that, not only did it record the speed inaccurately but that it did so to such a degree that there is doubt that the speed limit was exceeded at all. (e.g. if the speed alleged is 85mph he will have to demonstrate sufficient doubt that it was out by 15mph). There is no statutory requirement to calibrate speed guns or cameras at any particular intervals and the defence, such that it is, is rarely successful.
> The information will not be routinely provided and will certainly not be available to enable the driver to decide whether or not to accept a Fixed Penalty Offer. <
gives the plod plenty of time to fill in the details and bring all the paper work up to date then the jp will always believe what he is told
gives the plod plenty of time to fill in the details and bring all the paper work up to date then the jp will always believe what he is told
mikey they are not meant to be cash cows they are to stop speeding drivers and make the roads safer take a look at daves post
> sunny-dave
They are supposed to have two warning signs plus hi-viz jackets and be in an easily visible location - so that they encourage safe driving.
They actually hide round corners with no signage at all - so that they make money ....
19:25 Mon 10th Mar 201
> sunny-dave
They are supposed to have two warning signs plus hi-viz jackets and be in an easily visible location - so that they encourage safe driving.
They actually hide round corners with no signage at all - so that they make money ....
19:25 Mon 10th Mar 201
Yours is an interesting point, Dr F (your suggestion that it might be sharp practice for police to hide round corners with speed guns). Supposing they hid in the bushes of a garden where a house had been regularly burgled in order to apprehend the burglars. Would that be sharp practice too? Or is it that speed cameras and guns are said to be used for safety reasons and not for the apprehension of law-breakers?
No TWR, the prosecution does not have to provide details of calibration tests etc unless the issue is raised as a doubt by the defendant. If such a doubt is raised the onus shifts to the defence to prove the doubt (though this is at the lower standard of “on the balance of probabilities” – i.e. that is more likely than not to be so). Simply suggesting or suspecting that the machine is inaccurate is not sufficient to cast such a doubt as, without evidence to the contrary the machine is assumed to be accurate as it will have been type approved by the Home Office (or Department of Justice). The defendant will have to show that such inaccuracies do occur and that they have occurred and that these inaccuracies are likely to be present in the machine in question. It is not an easy defence and rarely succeeds, hence my suggestion not to bother with it.
No TWR, the prosecution does not have to provide details of calibration tests etc unless the issue is raised as a doubt by the defendant. If such a doubt is raised the onus shifts to the defence to prove the doubt (though this is at the lower standard of “on the balance of probabilities” – i.e. that is more likely than not to be so). Simply suggesting or suspecting that the machine is inaccurate is not sufficient to cast such a doubt as, without evidence to the contrary the machine is assumed to be accurate as it will have been type approved by the Home Office (or Department of Justice). The defendant will have to show that such inaccuracies do occur and that they have occurred and that these inaccuracies are likely to be present in the machine in question. It is not an easy defence and rarely succeeds, hence my suggestion not to bother with it.
whilst speed cameras are annoying and i have been caught twice, i do think there are lot of people who get irate about them yet cant seem to see that if they didnt speed it wouldnt affect them - its laughable really.
they may well be cash cows - a source of revenue - but whats the alternative?
what should we replace speed cameras with?
they give ample warning of their presense, with signs and a big yellow box, so anyone who still gets caught, and has to pay towards this cash cow, only has themselves to blame!
really they should not be warned - i think the problems people mention - that they get caught and potentially cause accidents with people slamming on, would reduce if people did not know where the cameras were.
people speed because they know that they can get away with it until they see a yellow box, then they slow down ... then speed up again
if they did not have this mentality they would not be in this habit of generally speeding unless they see a box
the only way to stop people speeding is to make them think they could be caught at any time without their knowledge ... they would soon start to drive with the speed limit in mind, instead of "playing the beat the speed cameras game"
they may well be cash cows - a source of revenue - but whats the alternative?
what should we replace speed cameras with?
they give ample warning of their presense, with signs and a big yellow box, so anyone who still gets caught, and has to pay towards this cash cow, only has themselves to blame!
really they should not be warned - i think the problems people mention - that they get caught and potentially cause accidents with people slamming on, would reduce if people did not know where the cameras were.
people speed because they know that they can get away with it until they see a yellow box, then they slow down ... then speed up again
if they did not have this mentality they would not be in this habit of generally speeding unless they see a box
the only way to stop people speeding is to make them think they could be caught at any time without their knowledge ... they would soon start to drive with the speed limit in mind, instead of "playing the beat the speed cameras game"
No hypocrisy at all. I'd not feel charitable if a non speeding motorist killed a loved one. The connection to speed cameras is not warranted since the lack of charity has nothing to do with speed. And anyway the issue is with being spied on by the cameras not with driving safely. One needs to be clear on the issues before starting a thread.
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