Should we allow Sharia law courts?

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail....ders-close-ranks.html

Are the Ministry of Justice right to abandoned an inquiry into the rise of secretive Sharia councils?

Will this decision give rise to an increase in these illegal Sharia councils?

[IggyB]

The way all you haters are blathering along seems to imply you think you might get hauled up in front of a sharia court and told to grow a beard and attend mosque. The religious courts of the jewish and muslim faith are not going to affect the majority of people in the uk - they are only going to affect those that actively choose to participate AND if they don't like whats told to them its not legally binding and they can just ignore it... If it isn't affecting you, has no chance of affecting you in the future and only involves a tiny percentage of the population who seem quite happy with it why are you all so angry about it?

[Safiya]

oh iggy.... you've spoiled it now..... i was finding it all quite entertaining :)

[anotheoldgit]

daisya

Your excellent post 17:39 Sat 30th Jul 2011, sums up the situation that we now find ourselves in, perfectly.

[boxtops]

How come, AOG, when iggy's post this morning - and others earlier - make it quite clear that a shariah court wouldn't affect the majority of other UK residents, anyway?

[anotheoldgit]

/// Sharia Law WILL NEVER SUPLLANTS ENGLISH LAW.///

In answer to both sp1814 & you boxtops.

Other's laws can often be drawn into English Law, and so become 'the law of the land'.

There have been numerous examples such as the weapon that can only be carried by those of a certain religion, and the non wearing of crash helmets.

I, as an indigenous person would not be allowed any of these exceptions under English Law.

[ChuckFickens]

"I, as an indigenous person would not be allowed any of these exceptions under English Law."

Yes you would. just convert to the relevant religion and it makes no difference where you come from.

[modeller]

Safiya I am aware of surah 2.229 and after , which does not alter the basic fact your husband can divorce you by verbally telling you three times , the triple-talaq. In fact now he can do it by just sending you an email. You on the other hand you can never divorce him once the marriage has been consummated without his permission.
I agree the Sharia Council can intervene but that varies in every country and invariably sides with the man. I would also point out Sharia Law is not a part of the Koran it is man made and as such open to different interpretations, from common sense to brutality.
see http://www.thereligio.../005-triple-talaq.htm

[Safiya]

I guess that depends on which Madhab is followed modeller

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Talaq_%28Nikah%29 ..... taken from so far down the page *The Triple Talaq in one sitting doesn't find any place in Quran and is termed as Unislamic.*

*You on the other hand you can never divorce him once the marriage has been consummated without his permission. * okay lets forget about sharia council on this one for a minute and say okay i cant divorce my husband without his permission..... just because he is entitled to say no doesnt mean he will or that any other muslim guy will refuse their wife permission to divorce for that matter......

heres what happened in my last marriage (english marriage) my then husband left me for another woman.... he moved straight in with her and asked me to divorce him as i was entitled to legal aid and he wasnt.... i started divorce proceeding straight away...... he admitted adultery.... months went by and he didnt sign the papers.... more months went by and he still didnt sign the papers...... why? only he knows....... i was told if he didnt sign i had to wait either 2 or 5 years for the divorce to be finalised (sorry cant remember length of time)...... eventually after me flipping my lid almost 2 years later he finally signed the papers...... is that not very similar? he wouldnt give consent to the divorce therefore i had to wait stupid amounts of time until he decided to.... or wait even longer til the prescribed time was up if he wouldnt

thanks for pointing out where Sharia Law comes from, but you could have saved yourself the time taken to type...i already know

you say the Sharia Council invariably sides with the man.... so i guess you know lots of people this has happened to?

I wont be coming back to this thread.... the OP was about Sharia Law Courts...not just marriage and my personal life..... all i did was ask should i be done for treason ........

[whiskeryron]

Safiya, I am genuinely sorry you are leaving this thread I can see that you have had enough, let me say that I have enjoyed your participation, you have taught me a lot that I did not know so for me it has been quite educational.
Ron.

[modeller]

I agree entirely with ron.
Islam is misunderstood in the west and I give talks on Islam and try to answer some very difficult questions especially concerning the role of women .I have learnt some more today for which I thank you . It must be very difficult for you at times.

[anotheoldgit]

/// the OP was about Sharia Law Courts...not just marriage and my personal life.....///

Excuse me Safiya I don't want to appear rude, but wasn't it you that chose to tell us all about your marriage and personal life?

Incidentally since I have often wondered how this 'Legal Aid' works, I would be interested to know why you were allowed Legal Aid, but your ex-Husband wasn't?

That is unless it it is too personal.

[Safiya]

aog i actually came back here to answer modeller as even though i said i wasnt coming back im not ignorant, i got halfway through typing and i heard call to prayer so had to leave... as you are now here ill answer you when ive done....

ron... i answered your post in one of your questions when i saw it earlier....

thanks for that modeller... im unsure what you think may be difficult... peoples attitudes or being a Muslim woman.... the latter is no problem and causes no difficulty at all..... I can honestly say Ive never been happier in my life.... the former.... I tend to ignore it in real life, but at least the people with attitude have the balls to give it to me as a real person, not hiding behind a monitor like happens a lot online......

[sandyRoe]

How are they 'illegal Sharia councils'?

[Safiya]

aog..... *Excuse me Safiya I don't want to appear rude, but wasn't it you that chose to tell us all about your marriage and personal life? *

to start with i just intended to make my first post..... i mentioned marriage as its an aspect of Sharia that even though im in england it concerns me..... im sure you can see that it followed on from there, .... i was blaming no one for me commenting about my personal life... I just thought that when I felt I had to use a real life situation to get a point across it was time to come out of the thread ....... the legal aid..... i worked part time my ex worked full time ...simple isnt it...

you really make me laugh you know... you post threads such as these... asking a question then slink off to sit back and watch the fall out...... i thought the reason for putting up a question/debate was to actually join in it beyond bobbing on and prostrating to those that agree with you however slightly.... and twisting the words of others that dont... its usually the same few people you pick on for that..... theres tons of interesting stuff been said in this thread you could have replied to yet you replied twice to me (once twisting my words and the other im answering now) once to daisy where you just agreed and once to SP (who is one of the people you seem to single out a lot imo ....hope SP doesnt mind me saying that)

to me it seems you are nothing more than a trouble causer aog.... i guess now you will come back and call me insulting or aggressive like you normally do.....

[Safiya]

sandy..... i saw your earlier comments when i re read the thread after i said i wasnt comin back.... i agree with what you said about drunken people on the streets

[Zeuhl]

<<to me it seems you are nothing more than a trouble causer aog>>

Safiya, you are in danger of being accused of rudeness by the Old Git.
That is the penalty for making accurate but unpalatable criticisms of a certain type of person.

[Safiya]

oh flip i mentioned aggressive and insulting ... i forgot rude... ta for that zeuhl lol....

[DTCwordfan]

AOGs view of old England, couurtesy of an adapted Mathew Arnold poem - coincidentlally a libertarian

The sea is calm to-night.
The country is ful of citizens, the moon lies sad
Upon the straits where incomers illegally cross;
—on the French coast the light
Gleams and is gone;
the cliffs of England stand,
Glimmering and vast, out in the tranquil bay.
Come to the window, and shout down the immigrant-air!
Only, from the long line of spray
Where the sea meets the moon-blanch'd land,
Listen! you hear no Immigrants or Heathen roar
Of rabble which the right-wing want drawn back, and fling,
At their return, off England's high strand,
Begin, and cease, and then again begin,
With tremulous expulsion quick, and bring
The eternal note of bigotry within.

[THECORBYLOON]

aog wrote ” Other's laws can often be drawn into English Law, and so become 'the law of the land'.

There have been numerous examples such as the weapon that can only be carried by those of a certain religion, and the non wearing of crash helmets.

I, as an indigenous person would not be allowed any of these exceptions under English Law.”

The Criminal Justice Act 1988 allows articles with a blade or point in a public place for religious reasons. The same Act allows a blade to be carried as part of a national dress. So, aog, you can wear a kilt and carry a sgian-dubh.

[DTCwordfan]

Bet he looks good in a skirt.