ChatterBank1 min ago
Scottish independence referendum
24 Answers
http://www.guardian.c...-referendum-yes-or-no
We have heard much regarding the Falklands, let's now get a little nearer to home, I refer of course to the Scottish question.
Mr Cameron is offering the Scots more power. But only if they vote No:
I have a funny feeling that England is once again going to sold down the line, don't we have anyone to stand up for our rights?
For starters before Cameron makes any under-handed deals with the Scots, we should first have a say in it.
Perhaps we should have a referendum which asks, do we really want to tied to Scotland?
We have heard much regarding the Falklands, let's now get a little nearer to home, I refer of course to the Scottish question.
Mr Cameron is offering the Scots more power. But only if they vote No:
I have a funny feeling that England is once again going to sold down the line, don't we have anyone to stand up for our rights?
For starters before Cameron makes any under-handed deals with the Scots, we should first have a say in it.
Perhaps we should have a referendum which asks, do we really want to tied to Scotland?
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The decision as to whether they want independence or not is entirely for teh scots to make. That's the single question that they have to answer.
What they shouldn't be able to do is to slip another question onto the ballot that demands different terms of the union - that's something they can't decide unilateraly, but has to be considered by the union as a whole.
This is of course what Salmond wants to do because he thinks he's going to lose the ballot on simple yes/no independence.
It's a bit like if I said to my boss. 'I've been trying to decide whether to leave the company or not, and after much consideration I've decided to stay, but I've also decided that I'm going to get a 50% pay rise'.
What they shouldn't be able to do is to slip another question onto the ballot that demands different terms of the union - that's something they can't decide unilateraly, but has to be considered by the union as a whole.
This is of course what Salmond wants to do because he thinks he's going to lose the ballot on simple yes/no independence.
It's a bit like if I said to my boss. 'I've been trying to decide whether to leave the company or not, and after much consideration I've decided to stay, but I've also decided that I'm going to get a 50% pay rise'.
magnacarter
/// i am scottish and proud to be so, ///
/// but i do get annoyed when english and others americans mainly say england when it should be Britain ///
I am English and also proud to be so.
I don't know why you get annoyed, when the English, Americans and others say English they must be referring to the country of England and it's inhabitants so they rightfully say 'English' there is no such country as 'Britain' now.
If the English, Americans and others refer to the England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland as a whole, they either say the U.K. or the United Kingdom.
/// i am scottish and proud to be so, ///
/// but i do get annoyed when english and others americans mainly say england when it should be Britain ///
I am English and also proud to be so.
I don't know why you get annoyed, when the English, Americans and others say English they must be referring to the country of England and it's inhabitants so they rightfully say 'English' there is no such country as 'Britain' now.
If the English, Americans and others refer to the England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland as a whole, they either say the U.K. or the United Kingdom.
LIBERTY – The Corries
By the cross oor Andrew bore by the sword oor William wore
By the crown oor Robert swore to win our Liberty
Ca’ the falcon fae the glen ca’ the eagle fae the ben
Ca’ the lion fae his den to win our Liberty
By the man wha’s faith was old by the man they sold for gold
By the man they'll never hold to win oor Liberty
Ca’ the thieves o’ Liddesdale ca’ the spears of Allendale
Ca’ the brave o’ Yarrow Vale to win oor Liberty
By the arm that bends the bow by the arm that plies the blow
By the arm that lays them low to win oor Liberty
Ca’ the banner fae the West ca’ the raven fae his nest
Ca’ the clans that dance the best to win oor Liberty
By the field that once was green by the shield that silver sheen
By the sword in battle keen to win oor Liberty
Bless the man wha’s faith we hold bless the man in chains they sold
Bless the man in cloth o’ gold wha won oor Liberty
Bless the man in cloth o’ gold wha won oor Liberty
By the cross oor Andrew bore by the sword oor William wore
By the crown oor Robert swore to win our Liberty
Ca’ the falcon fae the glen ca’ the eagle fae the ben
Ca’ the lion fae his den to win our Liberty
By the man wha’s faith was old by the man they sold for gold
By the man they'll never hold to win oor Liberty
Ca’ the thieves o’ Liddesdale ca’ the spears of Allendale
Ca’ the brave o’ Yarrow Vale to win oor Liberty
By the arm that bends the bow by the arm that plies the blow
By the arm that lays them low to win oor Liberty
Ca’ the banner fae the West ca’ the raven fae his nest
Ca’ the clans that dance the best to win oor Liberty
By the field that once was green by the shield that silver sheen
By the sword in battle keen to win oor Liberty
Bless the man wha’s faith we hold bless the man in chains they sold
Bless the man in cloth o’ gold wha won oor Liberty
Bless the man in cloth o’ gold wha won oor Liberty
Haggisdj
/// Also when people complain about Scots, Irish, and Welsh being on the BBC, the BBC, the BRITISH Broadcasting Corporation!! ///
I have never heard anyone complain about Scots, Irish, and Welsh being on the BBC.
Yes of course the BBC means the British Broadcasting Corporation, although now it would be more appropriate for it to be called the U.K. Broadcasting Service, UKBS.
/// Also when people complain about Scots, Irish, and Welsh being on the BBC, the BBC, the BRITISH Broadcasting Corporation!! ///
I have never heard anyone complain about Scots, Irish, and Welsh being on the BBC.
Yes of course the BBC means the British Broadcasting Corporation, although now it would be more appropriate for it to be called the U.K. Broadcasting Service, UKBS.
“The decision as to whether they want independence or not is entirely for teh scots to make”
Whether they want it or not may well be a decision for them to make, Ludwig. But unless they go down the route of declaring independence unilaterally, whether it is granted is actually a matter for the Westminster Parliament. This point was adequately debated a few weeks ago.
However, Mr Cameron’s latest wheeze (the so-called “devo-max” which he will no doubt describe as “fair” as he does everything else) opens up an entirely different debate. His suggestion that should the Scots vote to remain in the Union they may be granted even more powers and rights is certainly not a matter for the Scots. They already enjoy powers, privileges and benefits not afforded to other citizens of the United Kingdom. Any further transfer of powers is not a matter for the Scots but the UK Parliament.
In fact the Prime Minister need not make any offers to the Scots. There is not a cat in hell’s chance of them voting for independence either now or in the foreseeable future. He should let Mr Salmond’s parish council hold its referendum whenever it wants without interference the wallow in the resounding “No” vote the Scots will undoubtedly return.
Whether they want it or not may well be a decision for them to make, Ludwig. But unless they go down the route of declaring independence unilaterally, whether it is granted is actually a matter for the Westminster Parliament. This point was adequately debated a few weeks ago.
However, Mr Cameron’s latest wheeze (the so-called “devo-max” which he will no doubt describe as “fair” as he does everything else) opens up an entirely different debate. His suggestion that should the Scots vote to remain in the Union they may be granted even more powers and rights is certainly not a matter for the Scots. They already enjoy powers, privileges and benefits not afforded to other citizens of the United Kingdom. Any further transfer of powers is not a matter for the Scots but the UK Parliament.
In fact the Prime Minister need not make any offers to the Scots. There is not a cat in hell’s chance of them voting for independence either now or in the foreseeable future. He should let Mr Salmond’s parish council hold its referendum whenever it wants without interference the wallow in the resounding “No” vote the Scots will undoubtedly return.
// His suggestion that should the Scots vote to remain in the Union they may be granted even more powers and rights is certainly not a matter for the Scots. They already enjoy powers, privileges and benefits not afforded to other citizens of the United Kingdom. Any further transfer of powers is not a matter for the Scots but the UK Parliament. //
That was my point.
That was my point.
No Gromit. Your analogy is not correct at all.
This was all debated a few weeks ago, but it’s quite straightforward. In summary, the United Kingdom is a single sovereign state ruled by the Westminster Parliament. There are no independent constituent nations. None of the devolved bodies handling some matters in Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland has the power to hold a referendum without the agreement of Westminster and none has the right to be granted, on demand, their “independence” from the Union.
The same is not true for member states of the EU (at least for the moment, anyway). Each of the 27 members is a sovereign state with its own government. Each can choose to leave the EU any time it pleases. That is precisely why continued integration with the EU should be resisted. Eventually a treaty will be put forward that declares the EU a single nation state, ruled from Brussels (with, of course, their monthly sojourn to Strasbourg). Then the sovereign states will lose their right to leave the EU just as Scotland lost its right to independence when they signed the Act of Union.
This was all debated a few weeks ago, but it’s quite straightforward. In summary, the United Kingdom is a single sovereign state ruled by the Westminster Parliament. There are no independent constituent nations. None of the devolved bodies handling some matters in Scotland, Wales or Northern Ireland has the power to hold a referendum without the agreement of Westminster and none has the right to be granted, on demand, their “independence” from the Union.
The same is not true for member states of the EU (at least for the moment, anyway). Each of the 27 members is a sovereign state with its own government. Each can choose to leave the EU any time it pleases. That is precisely why continued integration with the EU should be resisted. Eventually a treaty will be put forward that declares the EU a single nation state, ruled from Brussels (with, of course, their monthly sojourn to Strasbourg). Then the sovereign states will lose their right to leave the EU just as Scotland lost its right to independence when they signed the Act of Union.
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"If the English, Americans and others refer to the England, Scotland, Wales and Northern Ireland as a whole, they either say the U.K. or the United Kingdom."
Anotheoldgit, you know fine well that many English folk and foreigners speak of England and the English when they mean Great Britain or the UK and the British.
Even you have referred to an English socialist government introducing university fees.
Anotheoldgit, you know fine well that many English folk and foreigners speak of England and the English when they mean Great Britain or the UK and the British.
Even you have referred to an English socialist government introducing university fees.
“I was never a passionate devolutionist. It is a dangerous game to play. You can never be sure where nationalist sentiment ends and separatist sentiment begins,” .
“I supported the UK, distrusted nationalism as a concept and looked at the history books and worried whether we could get it through.
“However, though not passionate about it, I thought it inevitable. We didn’t want Scotland to feel the choice was status quo or separation. And it was a central part of our programme for Scotland.”
A. C. L. Blair
“I supported the UK, distrusted nationalism as a concept and looked at the history books and worried whether we could get it through.
“However, though not passionate about it, I thought it inevitable. We didn’t want Scotland to feel the choice was status quo or separation. And it was a central part of our programme for Scotland.”
A. C. L. Blair
