Female circumcision.

[anotheoldgit]

http://www.dailymail....llegally-Britain.html

With as many as 100,000 women who have undergone this brutal genital mutilation illegally in Britain, why are the police failing to act against this barbaric practice?

/// The Metropolitan Police said since 2008, it had received 166 reports of people who fear they are at risk of FGM but it has failed to bring forward a single perpetrator. ///

/// It is the same for all 43 forces across England and Wales with no convictions for the offence ever taking place.///

[jomifl]

Keyplus,when are you going to address your 'few' problems.

[sandyRoe]

Is there any tradition of this procedure anywhere outside of the Islamic world?

[jomifl]

Sandy, I think it goes on in a lot of primitive societies.

[boxtops]

certanly sandyroe - prevalent in some African cultures (forgive me if that's been said before but I'm not ploughing through all of this). It's not a religious practice, it's cultural - there's a huge difference.

[DaisyNonna]

So what is the real reason for it? Men do not want women to enjoy sex or are frightened that another man might give their women pleasure and they cannot? The wish to inflict pain and suffering on little girls? A male ego trip?

[emmie]

Female genital mutilation
Description Partial or complete removal of the external female genitalia, or other injury to the female genital organs, for non-medical reasons
Areas practiced Western, eastern, and north-eastern Africa, Middle East, Near East, Southeast Asia
Number affected 135 million women and girls as of 1997
Age performed A few days after birth to age 15; occasionally in adulthood

as i said it's barbaric, and widespread.

[naomi24]

Boxy, It is most definitely not simply a cultural practice. It is often very much a religious practice. Please read the thread.

[Brenden]

I think Daisy Islam is a mans religion - women are chattel.

[DaisyNonna]

Brenden, which is partly why I asked the question.

[boxtops]

i still maintain it's cultural - your citation endorses this - the fact that it's happening in Islamic countries doesn't mean it's exclusive to Islam. From the quote given, it suggests that it was going on long before the advent of Islam.

[jomifl]

Boxtops it doesn't have to be invented by a religion to be part of it's dogma.

[boxtops]

I agree with that, jomifl - many religions have incorporated practices from cultures which were there before they were.

[DaisyNonna]

It matters not one jot whether it is a religious or cultural practice. It should be eliminated now! But how? If women are too scared of repercussions from their husbands what is the solution? Government is full of talk and no action. If an act is illegal, which it is, how can it be eradicated?

[emmie]

the answer is it can't. Mediaeval mindsets, cultural practices that have no place in any society, but superstition abounds, and until doctors, and all practitioners are caught, jailed, then it will persist.
The police in Britain are largely powerless it seems, the silence that surrounds this seems to be the key, break the silence of the people that are affected by it, and maybe you could see a lessening of this cruelty

[naomi24]

Boxy, no one is suggesting it’s exclusive to Islam – or that it wasn’t happening before the advent of Islam - but excuses serve neither to bring the problem to the attention of the public nor to cure it – and I would be willing to take an educated guess and say the main offenders on a worldwide scale are Muslims. Furthermore, you cannot in honesty maintain that it’s simply cultural when you have a perfect example right here where a group of Islamic fundamentalists, doctors and lawyers, led by a Sheikh, brought a brought a lawsuit before the Egyptian court arguing that the state could not forbid female circumcision because it is required under Islamic law. That is plain enough. This, they claim, is a religious requirement – not a cultural one – and they are not alone. You consistently deny the less savoury aspects of Islam, but denial amounts to closing your eyes to that which you find distasteful. You don’t want to believe it. I find it distasteful too - everyone on this thread finds it distasteful - no one is condoning it – but the fact is it is happening – and it is happening right here in this country. If unacceptable practices (and there are more) are ever going to be eradicated, then those of us who do care about the plight of these girls must speak out. We know it’s happening and if we don’t oppose it, then we are inadvertently condoning it and we are doing these children, who are at the mercy of barbarians, no favours at all.

So let’s look at female circumcision within Islam.

1 This is not general practice and few Muslims support it.

2 Some Muslims insist upon it and find justification for it within their religious literature.


They are the facts. Face them.


Daisy, how can it be eradicated? The million dollar question. Here we are dealing with medieval mindsets full of superstition, secrecy, and mistrust - and a culture wholly alien to our own. We cannot comprehend how these people think - and short of insisting that all adults attend special education classes and all female children be regularly medically examined, I really don’t know the answer. I wish I did.

[DaisyNonna]

Naomi, regular medical examination of female children I would imagine to be a breech of somebody's human rights, unfortunately. Telling every woman who gives birth to a female child that circumcision is illegal would be a start. Probably not making a difference but supporting women who are against the practice may make a tiny crack in the wall of silence.

[naomi24]

It might help, Daisy - but I think you'll find that within such a culture, men are the decision makers - and women do as they're told.

Got to go to bed now. Night all. x

[pdust]

naomi have you got another example instead of the one you used? its just that im still puzzled by the 3 new Hadith (this is the same one isnt it? sorry my memory really is crap)

[DaisyNonna]

So what remains? Any girl or woman who has been so abused by her family should be supported in bringing charges against her parents. Obviously a very small number, but any campaign has to begin with a tiny step. What would the legal charge be? What would be the sentence? Who would support this?

[naomi24]

Pixi, no I don’t have another example of a case being brought before the courts.

Daisy,// Any girl or woman who has been so abused by her family should be supported in bringing charges against her parents.//

As I said, in such a society, men make the rules and women obey them without question, because that is what they have been taught to do. There are support groups, but it doesn’t occur to the victims that, as human beings, they have rights, and, therefore they suffer in silence. They remain voiceless.