Is This Really A Good Idea?

[youngmafbog]

http://news.sky.com/story/1422273/british-army-seeks-to-recruit-more-muslim-troops

I suspect I am going to invoke anger from some on here but I'll put the argument anyway.

Surely bringing more Muslims into the armed forces when we are at war with a faction of the religion is not a good idea. I am well aware that many Muslims do not agree with the fanatics (although many keep silent on it) but how can we tell them apart? OK, it's a religion so you can never be 100 % who is what but if someone is leaning that way why go out of your way to invite them in?

It's pretty much akin to enlisting Germans into our forces during WW2. Many Germans did not agree with Hitler but as you could not tell the safest option is to keep them at arms length.

I think it really does show our MP's and Forces seniors have not got to grips with this new challenge.

[-Talbot-]

Labour MP Khalid Mahmood says 2,000 jihadists have travelled to Syria and Iraq from the UK - a fourfold increase on official estimates

Figures released by the Ministry of Defence reveal there are only 480 Muslims serving in Army.




I'm not sure what this says but it does say something.

[woofgang]

If muslim terrorists want to infiltrate the Army (or anywhere else) its not going to be that difficult for them to use "atypical" muslims. If we truly want any minority to integrate into British life then surely they need to be made welcome everywhere, including the Army and the Police.

[Peter Pedant]

O God YMF you do come out with some utter tosh

No ( or Yes ) the British Army DID recruit Roman Catholics into the army during the IRA troubles. As an English RC I had to endure gratuitous insults over my supposed lack of loyalty to the Queen

and Yes the children of Japanese immigrants were co-opted along with the other dough-boys during the 2 nd WW in the pacific - and had - whilst they were serving for Uncle Sam endure letters from their parents over the hardships of internment

and as the Gurkhas show, non Christians can loyally serve the Crown.
( kill people and win medals )

The challenge is to enlist more and persuade those born in England they really are welcome

[ToraToraTora]

No, silly idea, how long before one of the ROP joins the army gets trained and when given a chance machine guns load of them. Dam stupid idea if you ask me.

[RATTER15]

*** Muslims should not be allowed near guns or anything sharp!!

[RATTER15]

or anything that goes bang!!

[Sqad]

It is bad enough having women "watching your back" in a theatre of war.........but women AND Muslims.........I don't think so.

[sp1814]

TTT

Would you support a ban on Muslims joining the armed services?

[youngmafbog]

//O God YMF you do come out with some utter tosh //

I posed a question, there is not need for that because you disagree is ther?

//and as the Gurkhas show, non Christians can loyally serve the Crown.
( kill people and win medals ) //

As fare as I am aware the Gurkhas were not at war with us?

Islamic fanatics are not your usual type of people. We are talking out and out nutters. You cannot compare the IRA with them in the slightest. To do so rather shows you do not understand the problem.

Nowhere did I say only Christians could join. You made that up.

[youngmafbog]

SP, why dont you give your view? Or are you just out to dig at TTT?

[RATTER15]

//Would you support a ban on Muslims joining the armed services?//

I certainly would!!

[ToraToraTora]

Well SP we are always being told that the religion is the most important thing to a Muslim so I would not trust them with weapons around the infidel,so on that basis it follows that they should not be in the forces. I know there are some so we await the first atrocity. What is to stop those like the killers of Lee Rigby, joining up and training for years to suddenly machine gun 50 troops when the chance presents itself?

[grasscarp]

I feel that people should be free to go for whatever career they want. I also dont like recruitment aimed at particular people to satisfy quotas, political correctness etc. Let anyone apply and take those who fit the criteria for age, fitness, intelligence whatever - but not based on religion. So in answer to question - I dont see this as a "good idea".

[retrocop]

I don't think the MOD could afford to have any Muslims in the armed forces in the modern days of automatic weapons. Judging how they expend vast amounts of ammo into the air from their AK 74's etc in a state of frenzied excitement we would soon run out of munitions to achieve the real purpose. I wouldn't trust a Muslim barber with a cut throat razor during our present conflicts. Shame though because if they were to be trusted they would make good Intel gatherers. No one seriously denies the valour and loyal service shown to this country by Muslims in past conflicts,but, DEFINITELY NOT this one.

[retrocop]

Just think back to Afghan recently. The amount of rogue Afghan National Army who turned their weapons on British/ American soldiers. Those very soldiers who were sent to help and train them.

[Old_Geezer]

Muslims believe in a particular religion, they are not a nation one can declare war on. So I don't think comparisons with Wartime Germany are reasonable.

For sure recruiting folk you feel unsure about needs consideration. But I think any ban would cause more problems than it solved. Refusing suspected individuals is one thing, a blanket refusal to recruit is quite another.

In any case should an IS sympathiser wish to apply it is perfectly possible they could get through anyway.

Plus it is vital that any action against terrorising military forces is done with the active consent/action of those who might be confused as part of the same overall group. We don't need to allow the chance to pretend it is one group imposing on another, but clarify it is combating an evil force in alliance, together.

Overall, provided the risks are known and due diligence carried out during recruitment, then I think it is a good thing. It's not risk-proof, but nothing ever is.

[naomi24]

The problem is Muslims put Islam before patriotism, so really the bottom line is if push comes to shove and they're expected to fight other Muslims, where will their loyalties lie? I suspect not with the British army.

[Peter Pedant]

// As fare as I am aware the Gurkhas were not at war with us? //

re read your history: at least one has the Gurkhas volunteering as mercenaries after seeing the British Army in India in action ( aginst themselves )

see wiki - Gurkha ( half wasy down page )


and yes the sons of German Jews served in the British Army in 1939

Honestly some ideas of yours are just stupid

[Booldawg]

The fact that such small numbers have voluntarily joined our armed forces shows how popular a chosen profession it is amongst the Islamic community.

If alarm bells aren't ringing then maybe its time to take of your PC Nonsense ear muffs?

[sp1814]

youngmafbog

I was not aware that I was having a dig. I thought I was asking for clarification.

I have a problem with the question of Muslims in the armed forces, because unfortunately I grew up in a very racially diverse area so I tend to view Muslims as individuals, rather than as a group of people who all believe exactly the same thing and have exactly the same outlook in life.

If you think that all Muslims cannot be trusted, do you agree that they should be banned from serving in the armed forces?