How Can This Be Glibly Dismissed As Project Fear - It's Happening Now Thanks To Brexit.

[Canary42]

Seems like we've lost a very valuable trading partner.

https://uk.yahoo.com/news/japanese-aren-t-daft-why-080019995.html

To me it makes chilly reading.

For example
[In the 1980s this is where consensus was reached that Margaret Thatcher’s commitment to the European single market and customs union, along with her labour market reforms, offered a major opportunity for Japanese business. It would allow Britain to be the place where Japan could develop its famed “just-in-time” delivery system by sourcing production across Europe, without tariffs, regulatory and customs checks, and foster the recruitment and management of talent Europe-wide. They took her at her word, and the investment boom that has transformed the British car industry was born.

Today, a new Japanese consensus has formed. The Conservative party and its leaders cannot be trusted. They ignore warnings, break their word and do not understand business – personified by Old Etonians Boris Johnson and Jacob Rees-Mogg. Brexit is a first-order disaster, striking at the heart of how Japanese companies organise themselves as "lean manufacturers. "]

[ludwig]

// Really not much mileage in hysterically stomping your feet, waving your fists in the air, and turning your face blue by blaming all these economic changes upon Brexit. //

You'd better get used to it sanmac, because that's what will be happening for the next 50 years. Even if Brexit doesn't happen, that will be the reason.

I find it really depressing that I'll be hearing that word for the rest of my life.

[sanmac]

I think you could be right, Ludwig. Whichever way it goes it's going to be a bit of a shambles for a while.

[vetuste_ennemi]

// Look to your own camp, v-e. If Brexiteers had taken the warnings seriously...then maybe it would have been easier to reach a sensible version of Brexit...//

I'm somewhat aggrieved, Jim, that I and other Leavers are constantly accused of simple-mindedness. Or that there was a third position between Remain and Leave - unstated at the time of "people's vote", but now newly minted and stamped with the legend "DEAL".

I view the referendum as a "do you want a divorce" question. The UKIP vote had made it very clear that loads of people (across all political parties) didn't like the way the marriage with the EU was turning out, in which case the only two options are stay married or get divorced.

That doesn't mean there is nota very important "deal" bit": do we as (once loving) partners, and possibly parents, leave on amicable term, or with rancour?

Anybody who's seen as many divorces of friends and family understands the consequences of divorce and most especially its effect on children. What a shame that the the two parties in the Brexit divorce haven't acted in a spirit of goodwill. And how surprising that the lawyers acting in the interests of the husband seem to have been working on the side of the spiteful wife.

[Peter Pedant]

// that I and other Leavers are constantly accused of simple-mindedness.//

can I edit that to:
that I and other Leavers constantly betray simple-mindedness, of the most gormless or vacant kind, which makes other people gasp as they read about it.

[Calicogirl]

Hi Pete x

[vetuste_ennemi]

//can I edit that to:
that I and other Leavers constantly betray simple-mindedness, of the most gormless or vacant kind, which makes other people gasp as they read about it//

You can certainly edit to that, Peter Pedant.

And readers of my post (addressed to Jim) can judge, according their lights, the tone and intention of that post. And readers of your post can judge the tone and intention of yours.

[Calicogirl]

Oh come on VE, Pete always livens a thread up and is one of the more intellectual posters on here tbh, always cheers me up when I see him post. x

[vetuste_ennemi]

I am very impressed by PP's breadth of knowledge and intelligence, Calico Girl. And like most of his posts for those reasons.

But I don't like someone misrepresenting my character any more than you would like someone deliberately misspelling your name.

[Calicogirl]

I remember that VE! I genuinely thought you'd done that on purpose and called you something very rude :) x

[vetuste_ennemi]

That's OK.

Christian spirit of forgiveness and all, Callico Girl.

[vetuste_ennemi]

I should have said Calico Grill, shouldn't I?

[jim360]

Whilst I can see the divorce analogy, the difference is that neither the UK nor the EU can possibly be seen as just one entity. There were about 34 million people who voiced an opinion, and whilst one side came out ahead they were not exactly speaking unequivocally in favour of leaving.

It's hard to know how far to take this argument, because at some point I clearly stray into "we should never have started this path" territory, and yes I confess I wish we had not. What I suppose I mean is that we should have continued with far more care, consideration for both sides of the debate, and absolutely not with the determination to force something through by a certain date, in only one way, and with no regard for the concerns and fears of the other side.

[sanmac]

Y'all must admit that Brexit (Sounds like a breakfast cereal?) might not be good (If you think that way) for the general economy, but it's certainly pouring money into AB's coffers.

[Old_Geezer]

Whilst no one seriously believes a change doesn't come with disruption (anyone whose experienced a re-org in the organisation they work for can vouch for that) it's very clear from threads such as these that any misfortune is being used to have a go at Brexit and blame it, regardless how invalid that is.

It's the other side of the Project Fear coin. Normally one pushes unlikely scenarios as inevitable and don't highlight when they fail to materialise; but this bit is finding things that happen and claiming Brexit caused them. Shameful.

Folk should stop trying to act and speak against their own nation, and it's attempt to undo awful past decisions, and stop letting EU decisions affecting us be a reason to try to fall back with them, and instead support our decision to improve the nation's status and make the future a better one for us all.

[ichkeria]

Saying that Swindon might have closed regardless of Brexit (which it most certainly might) is not the same as saying Brexit is not a factor. But I can only repeat what was said earlier: the EU Japan trade deal is unlikely to have been a major factor

[Khandro]

The immanent departure of Nissan and Honda from the UK has nothing whatsoever to do with Brexit. The auto industry is in turmoil - all planning has electric vehicles as a priority.
Both companies are moving not simply out of the UK, but out of the EU - Nissan have a factory in Barcelona running at only 40% capacity but they are not going there.
The reason James Dyson is moving his research into electric cars to the Far East (but not his factory in the UK) is because he has been constantly hampered by EU restrictions in developing his plans in Europe.

[steg]

Calicogirl ///The Tory Brexiteers invented the notion of 'project fear' in the hope that those of us who could see what was happening and what was going to happen, ///

They never invented project fear they nicked it from the Scottish independence ref campaign

[ichkeria]

I don’t know about Nissan (which actually has not actually moved from the UK - yet) but Honda is not moving its headquarters from the UK - yet.
There may well be industries where “EU restrictions” are an impediment as it’s an ill wind ... but that’s not the case with the mass car industry

[ichkeria]

The slogan “take back control” was quite literally dreamt up by Dominic Cummings, who was never happy with his precious “take control”. It is therefore almost literally, the stuff of nightmares ;-)

[cassa333]

Socialism is the only doctrine that needs billionaires.

Without billionaires there’s no money to take and give away.

Capitalism doesn’t need billionaires it just makes them by default.