Edward Colston - Was He Such Bad Guy?

[ToraToraTora]

the first line of his wikipedia entry:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edward_Colston#Altruism_and_politics
"He supported and endowed schools, almshouses, hospitals and churches in Bristol, London and elsewhere. Many of his charitable foundations survive to this day" - yes he was a Slave trader but at that time so was the world and his wife. Many slave traders were black Africans. Not saying that excuses it but that was how it was at the time. Seems a little over the top to topple his statue 300 years after his death.

[youngmafbog]

Interesting. Explains a lot.

Why do you live here if we are so bad then?

[vulcan42]

I consider statues as 3D versions of paintings and photographs. Do we now destroy all paintings and photographs of past despots and slave traders that are held in museums, books etc, across the world?

[royfromaus]

jno
then they're somebody else's business, dannyk. You can always post stern reprimands on Nigerian social media if you want but there's nothing Britons can do about it. Britons can do something about the ones on British soil, and I'm pleased they have.





There you have it...jno supports lawlessness.

[dannyk13]

jno //You do realise that women wouldn't have the vote in Britain if it wasn't for violent protest// .
You don't know that.That is just an assumption on your part.

[jno]

I've answered your question, ymb, you avoided answering mine.

Do you realise just how much change in Britain has required violence? Women's suffrage is just a good recent instance.

[jno]

how did British women get the vote, then, dannyk? A full two generations behind Wyoming, and one generation behind New Zealand, neither of which involved violence? Why did suffragettes think it was necessary here? Were they wrong?

[jackthehat]

How much more powerful a message it would have sent if Bristol City Council had formally voted to remove this statue and invited those campaigning for its' removal to a peaceful event where it was taken down.
It could have been reinstated in an exhibition which set it in context alongside other images of the slave trade.
Whilst acknowledging the part played by black slavers and Portuguese and Dutch slave traders, this statue was on English soil of an Englishman who traded over 80,000 human beings to amass his fortune.

I decry the violence used but peaceful representations had had precisely no effect in persuading the powers-that-be that this particular statue was very upsetting to very many people.

[teacher1]

I wonder how many of that mob actually knew who the statue was. ?

[Peter Pedant]

// I decry the violence used but peaceful [jabba jabba jabba blah blah fill in what you want blah blah ,,,] particular statue was very upsetting to very many people.//

in AMerica when they arent burning police stations they are pulling down statues of confederate generals
and one historian commented
"This doesnt stop them being C19 confederate generals"

[Peter Pedant]

// I wonder how many of that mob actually knew who the statue was. ?//
rather than a slaver
or a C18 slaver
or just 'a bad man'

see Kripke - Naming and Necessity - edward colston is different to an C18 Bristol rich slaver
( because in every possible universe, Edw COlston is the same but the successful slaver may be someone else)

good answer - can I have best answer please?

[retrocop]

//the powers-that-be that this particular statue was very upsetting to very many people//

Probably not upsetting to the indigenous white people of Bristol.
I wonder if those who are upset by the statue today came from a generation of slaves forcibly bought here or did they come here voluntarily?
I recall a Black Student Union leader screaming for a bust of Cecil Rhodes to be removed from her Uni. Makes me wonder how she got to Uni unless of course it was through the Cecil Rhodes bursary granted to her Uni for the disadvantaged.

[Spicerack]

We gave ladies the vote, big mistake in my book, and if you can't behave we'll take it back off you.

[Spicerack]

The bloke in charge of the Rhodes Must Go nonsense was a Rhodes Scholar, retro.

[Spicerack]

They defaced the Lincoln Memorial in the US, yesterday.

[retrocop]

//The bloke in charge of the Rhodes Must Go nonsense was a Rhodes Scholar, retro. //
I thought the Rhodes Scholar was a blokess. My mistake

[Spicerack]

Remember that girl (possibly Bristol) who wanted to whitewash over the hideously white muriel in her college. It was of the students who died in the 1st WW.

[vulcan42]

It's a great pity that these people who are destroying statues of past slavers, couldn't turn their attention and anger to the slavery that exists world wide at the present time.

[retrocop]

Spicey
//Campaign organiser Sarah Atayero said: "We continue to believe that the removal and relocation of the monument to Cecil Rhodes is critical for Oxford to reckon with its past, and for Oxford to acknowledge the present-day issues it faces around racism and representation."

Oriel College denied claims that donors threatened to withdraw more than £100m of funding if the statue was removed.

Rhodes was a student at Oxford and a member of Oriel College in the 1870s and went on to become prime minister of the Cape Colony in the 1890s.

He also gave his name to the historical region known as Rhodesia, which is now Zambia and Zimbabwe.

When Rhodes died in 1902, he left money to Oriel College. A scholarship programme in his name has so far been awarded to more than 8,000 overseas students.//

There's gratitude for you!

[Spicerack]

Oh, I'm sure they may have been 'job' sharing, retro. Just didn't know her status.
I wouldn't mind if they stopped the scholarships. Something dark about them, imo.

[Spicerack]

Perhaps they had a new grifter since I was reading about it. ;)