Sutcliffe Is Dead

[barry1010]

He has finally got his wish

[Peter Pedant]

// might I suggest that you keep your disaparaging remarks to yourself.//
girls please stop squabbling and spitting and play nicely

I hadnt realised that there were so many lessons to learn

The detective sooper hammered the table when Sutcliffe came up for the xth time
and that is ..... observation bias I think
you form a picure of A and then when a piece of info comes in to refute it - - - you keep the picture and reject the info

so as info / data comes in - it becomes HARDER to form the correct conclusion and not easier

[happens in scientific theories alot]

[andy-hughes]

gness - // Longer, slower and more agonising would please me more than a quick death for him, Andy. I want him to have suffered.

Our friends saw their daughter go off to university with the same hopes for her as we had for our son, who had been a boyfriend of their daughter.
Our son graduated. Their daughter was hammered and stabbed to death by Sutcliffe with her body left in a dreadful state after a night out with her Uni friends as they began their third year.
I saw what it did to her parents. Dad's once cheery smile and wave to me as he walked to work became a nod as he aged before his time. The suffering of that family will never end. //

Given your personal involvement, I find your stance completely understandable.

It is not a stance I share, and would try not to, even with direct involvement, but it does invite a degree of understanding far more than people who simply shrug their shoulders and say we should avoid the cost of keeping someone incarcerated.

I simply cannot see that as a view I could live with, but I accept of course that we are all different, for our different reasons.

[retrocop]

Danny
If my memory serves me well wasn't Sutcliffe's wife a teacher called Sonia.I wonder how sharp she was at realising his disappearances from the matrimonial home coincided with the dates of the murders. I often wonder that a close relative could suspect him and maybe a little more forthcoming with their suspicions.

[gness]

I'd be a strange person to wish him and others like him a good death, Andy.

[retrocop]

//but I accept of course that we are all different, for our different reasons. //
Thanks. We can leave it at that. We'll never agree on this subject.

[andy-hughes]

retrocop - // Danny
If my memory serves me well wasn't Sutcliffe's wife a teacher called Sonia.I wonder how sharp she was at realising his disappearances from the matrimonial home coincided with the dates of the murders. I often wonder that a close relative could suspect him and maybe a little more forthcoming with their suspicions. //

I am sure that the timelines coincide with hundreds of not thousands of men - and it is human nature surely to believe that a man you love and share your life with could not be a cold-blooded killer.

[andy-hughes]

retrocop - // /but I accept of course that we are all different, for our different reasons. //
Thanks. We can leave it at that. We'll never agree on this subject. //

No problem at all - we are all a product of our individual views formed by our own personal experiences - but it is good to see what others think, and why they think it.

[andy-hughes]

gness - // I'd be a strange person to wish him and others like him a good death, Andy. //

Given your involvement, I can, as I have sad, absolutely understand why you feel like that.

But for those of us with no personal involvement, I find the casual throwaway comments really quite chilling because it says more about the people who make them, than the deceased individual we are discussing.

[Vagus]

I don’t think his death should be given as much air time as it has, raking over it all.
He died. That’s all that needs to be said.

[Peter Pedant]

// If my memory serves me well wasn't Sutcliffe's wife a teacher called Sonia//
Long unsavoury legal history to that
Sonia sued in libel until her last case ( which she lost )
and had to pay both sides costs

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sonia_Sutcliffe

law not working well in that case

[pixie374]

Andy, while I am not necessarily "all for it", I can see how im some exceptional circumstances, where somebody can't be rehabbed, it may be the more humane option (not necessarily here, as I'm not convinced he was even sane). But locking someone in a cage for life, is hardly a sign of "civilised" society either. And particularly so, if they either didn't know what they were doing, or couldn't help themselves, genuinely.
My first sentence was purely to say it isn't "murder" and that i don't think using emotive words, instead of accurate ones, is a fair debate.

[Peter Pedant]

// He died. That’s all that needs to be said.//

I hadnt realised mistakes were made and the perp cd have been caught sooner - later victims families who sued the police failed

[chrissa1]

“Oh dear, what a pity, never mind.”

[pixie374]

BTW, capital punishment is 100% a deterrent, as they don't do it again.
I don't believe anyone's punishment, however bad, should be altered in the hope of changing other people's behaviour. It should be purely about their crime.

[gness]

Andy. If I had no connection with one of his victims I'd still feel the same way about his death as I do.
For me not to do so would make me question my ability to empathise with the pain of his victims and their families.

[dannyk13]

AH. It was thought at the time that she must have known what was going on although there was no evidence of this.His first victim was killed after an argument with his wife.

//When her husband was found guilty for the murder of multiple women, Sonia remained married to him and continued to live in the family home in Bradford, with the couple eventually divorcing in 1994.//

[gness]

We were in America when our heartbroken son phoned to tell us what had happened. A phone call that will stay with me for ever.

Today I just can't say.....he died....never mind.

[agchristie]

"But locking someone in a cage for life, is hardly a sign of "civilised" society either."

Pix,theres little alternative to protect him.Thered be plenty who wudve killed him if he was released

[agchristie]

gness (hi) I know wot u mean but is Richard McCann wrong in yr view to have forgiven him? He lost his mum and effectively his sister.

[pixie374]

I totally understand that, gness, and I'm so sorry you were personally involved x

To a degree, I guess it depends what we all mean by "justice". To some, it will be revenge or punishment. And while that is completely understandable, I don't see where that gets us. Especially in a "civilised" country.
As far as I am concerned... we either keep people locked up, if we can maybe rehabilitate them to live safely. Treat them, out of public life, if they are criminally insane. And those who are neither, and will never be safe- euthanized them. I know that is more expensive, but why keep anyone locked up for decades until they die? I don't consider that a more civilised option. It seems more about vengeance.