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About time ?
After the abduction of that poor little girl in Portugal. Is it not time that we should adopt a complete zero tolerance on animals that prey on kids. I know it is not a foregone conclusion that it is indeed a nonce responsible, but i sadly feel it is but a matter of time until it is the case. I wish that we could bring back hanging for these b##tards. Kids should be safe all of the time. Parents should not have to worry about deviants . (Footnote) Please do not post comments regarding "why did the parents leave her there ?" as i am sure they will live with that for the rest of their lives.
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kags well said, but then I would say that wouldn't I because I am one of those hippy types more interested in the well being of sexual abusers than the victims (for life of me I have scrutinized my posts but can not see where I said or even implied that was my position
My last word on this thread as I know there will be plenty of opportunity to respond to new threads from the fundamentalist far right , the hang em high I rely on impassioned rhetoric; who needs facts or reason?
My last word on this thread as I know there will be plenty of opportunity to respond to new threads from the fundamentalist far right , the hang em high I rely on impassioned rhetoric; who needs facts or reason?
Does anyone else get ads from Google on the right hand side of this page for this topic with ads such as :
"Battered Women -Find the best deals at lowest price Choose from 1000s of products. uk.shopping.com"
and
"Abuse Poems - Specialy selected Abuse Poems. Thought-provoking and meaningful. www.PoemsAPlenty.com"
WTF!! - not very sensitive context sensitive ads for those who are experiencing/experienced issues that have been discussed in this thread. Sort it out AB!
"Battered Women -Find the best deals at lowest price Choose from 1000s of products. uk.shopping.com"
and
"Abuse Poems - Specialy selected Abuse Poems. Thought-provoking and meaningful. www.PoemsAPlenty.com"
WTF!! - not very sensitive context sensitive ads for those who are experiencing/experienced issues that have been discussed in this thread. Sort it out AB!
naomi24 this will be my last post on this topic as obviously you seem to pick and choose what you want to here.
You state "It [this post] related to an innocent 3 year old girl being abducted by a pedophile. " No it didn't. The question particularly states: "Is it not time that we should adopt a complete zero tolerance on animals that prey on kids".
I assume that you understand what Zero Tolerance means. I specifically ask the question as to what age 'kid' relates to to be informed it was 16.
Therefore my answer is No - Zero Tolerance should not happen. The reason for this is as my previous examples - ie mothers with mental health issues, kids of 14/15 who are sexually active etc.
Zero Tolerance means that they would be killed! why can't you understand that
If the question was "should a person who sexually assaults a 3 year old child be incarcerated for life?" then I would say yes (subject to the usual appeals processes etc). That was not the question.
You state "It [this post] related to an innocent 3 year old girl being abducted by a pedophile. " No it didn't. The question particularly states: "Is it not time that we should adopt a complete zero tolerance on animals that prey on kids".
I assume that you understand what Zero Tolerance means. I specifically ask the question as to what age 'kid' relates to to be informed it was 16.
Therefore my answer is No - Zero Tolerance should not happen. The reason for this is as my previous examples - ie mothers with mental health issues, kids of 14/15 who are sexually active etc.
Zero Tolerance means that they would be killed! why can't you understand that
If the question was "should a person who sexually assaults a 3 year old child be incarcerated for life?" then I would say yes (subject to the usual appeals processes etc). That was not the question.
pilchard The reason I brought up mothers with mental health issues was in relation to the following statement by Naomi "People who pose any threat whatsoever to children should be removed from society. Full stop"
You state: A 19 year should check how old the girl is before jumping in bed and take some responsibility and if he makes a mistake he faces the consequences. so when you were 19 you obviously asked all the girls you were seeing for id? I agree that a mistake has been made. But a lot of people on this post have asked for the death sentence and zero tolerance. So do you believe the 19 year old should die?
Roy Whiting was deemed by the psychiatrist to be a reoffender and therefore a high risk. as stated earlier, I would have no problem with the death penalty
Fred West committed his first murder in 1967. I can't find any details about him "testing the water" as you put it. Please can you supply some evidence to this.
With Peter Sutcliffe: "The first known assault by Sutcliffe was in Keighley on the night of 5 July 1975. He attacked Anna Rogulskyj (aged 36), who was walking alone, striking her unconscious with a ball-pein hammer and slashing her stomach with a knife. Disturbed by a neighbour, he left without killing her. " - you can't really get a lot more dangerous that that
So when you say: "Most sex offenders begin by testing the water and slowly build up their confidence thereby becoming more dangerous i.e " do you have any actual examples and proof, or just your own conjecture?
Vic
You accuse other people of picking out certain things and you are the worst offender.
Firstly i would never sleep with someone without getting to know them properly first, thereby never finding myself in this position. I take responsibility for my actions and wouldn't feel the need to blame someone else for my own failings.
Fred West was sexually abused by his own mother when he was a child and then abused an 8 year old girl from a nearby farm in Herefordshire when he was in his mid teens. He then went on to abuse the women and children in his life and was in court accused of such an offence and got off with it. And as we know his offences escalated and resulted in many rapes/assaults/torture/violence/deaths.
Peter Sutcliffe spent many years as a regular customer with prostitutes to satisfy his sexual perversions before deciding that wasn't enough to satisfy him, so he went on to murder.
Are you requesting fact or are you just searching on Google?
You also omitted to answer a couple of questions for me; have you got children and what age do deem 'old enough'?
And please DO NOT compare new mothers suffering with post natal depression with these creatures. They have enough to deal with from people like you judging them without you also comparing them with child molesters.
You accuse other people of picking out certain things and you are the worst offender.
Firstly i would never sleep with someone without getting to know them properly first, thereby never finding myself in this position. I take responsibility for my actions and wouldn't feel the need to blame someone else for my own failings.
Fred West was sexually abused by his own mother when he was a child and then abused an 8 year old girl from a nearby farm in Herefordshire when he was in his mid teens. He then went on to abuse the women and children in his life and was in court accused of such an offence and got off with it. And as we know his offences escalated and resulted in many rapes/assaults/torture/violence/deaths.
Peter Sutcliffe spent many years as a regular customer with prostitutes to satisfy his sexual perversions before deciding that wasn't enough to satisfy him, so he went on to murder.
Are you requesting fact or are you just searching on Google?
You also omitted to answer a couple of questions for me; have you got children and what age do deem 'old enough'?
And please DO NOT compare new mothers suffering with post natal depression with these creatures. They have enough to deal with from people like you judging them without you also comparing them with child molesters.
To answer your questions:
I have two step children and 2 grandchildren ages 3 and 1 There is also one more on the way.
What age is old enough? - I don't know - as I have repeatedly stated I will treat each issue on a case by case basis. There are plenty of 15 year olds who are sexually active and ready for a relationship. There are plenty of people who are older than 16 who are not ready for a sexual relationship. This is not a Black & White Issue - each case has to be dealt with individually
"Firstly i would never sleep with someone without getting to know them properly first, thereby never finding myself in this position. - I am exactly the same and have never had a one night stand - HOWEVER, this puts us in the minority in the country.
Do you think that every young adult who goes out on a Friday / Saturday night does the same. A good proportion of people who go nightclubbing are looking to have sex (note not a relationship). I really do not believe that they ask the other person for their driving license/ passport to prove their age.
Why do you think I am comparing mothers with mental issues to 'these monsters' I am not (and neither am I judging them). I am pointing out repeatedly why Zero Tolerance (remember the originalquestion?) should not be called for or instigated as these mothers (who you and I want to defend) would be killed by people like Naomi - remember her comment?
Being honest - I have now had enough. You are too blinkered to read my posts for some bizarre reason.
I can't be bothered to keep on repeating myself.
I have two step children and 2 grandchildren ages 3 and 1 There is also one more on the way.
What age is old enough? - I don't know - as I have repeatedly stated I will treat each issue on a case by case basis. There are plenty of 15 year olds who are sexually active and ready for a relationship. There are plenty of people who are older than 16 who are not ready for a sexual relationship. This is not a Black & White Issue - each case has to be dealt with individually
"Firstly i would never sleep with someone without getting to know them properly first, thereby never finding myself in this position. - I am exactly the same and have never had a one night stand - HOWEVER, this puts us in the minority in the country.
Do you think that every young adult who goes out on a Friday / Saturday night does the same. A good proportion of people who go nightclubbing are looking to have sex (note not a relationship). I really do not believe that they ask the other person for their driving license/ passport to prove their age.
Why do you think I am comparing mothers with mental issues to 'these monsters' I am not (and neither am I judging them). I am pointing out repeatedly why Zero Tolerance (remember the originalquestion?) should not be called for or instigated as these mothers (who you and I want to defend) would be killed by people like Naomi - remember her comment?
Being honest - I have now had enough. You are too blinkered to read my posts for some bizarre reason.
I can't be bothered to keep on repeating myself.
I think Vic is running out of steam.
I think this may be a generation thing.
If people want to sleep around with each other that entirely up to them. But they can't and should not seek sympathy if it bites them in the ars4.
You keep mentioning the age of 15, is this some sort if magical age. The law is the law, if you break it, either intentionally or through irresponsibility you face the consequences.
I would also like to mention that the 19 year old sleeping with the 15 year old would only be procescuted with the 15 year olds statement of evidence.
I would also like to state that i have never at any time suggested zero tolerance (maybe you should read my previous post). I believe that you should never gamble with childrens safety or lives and deciding who is low/medium/high risk is a load of cr*p.
One strike and your out!
I think this may be a generation thing.
If people want to sleep around with each other that entirely up to them. But they can't and should not seek sympathy if it bites them in the ars4.
You keep mentioning the age of 15, is this some sort if magical age. The law is the law, if you break it, either intentionally or through irresponsibility you face the consequences.
I would also like to mention that the 19 year old sleeping with the 15 year old would only be procescuted with the 15 year olds statement of evidence.
I would also like to state that i have never at any time suggested zero tolerance (maybe you should read my previous post). I believe that you should never gamble with childrens safety or lives and deciding who is low/medium/high risk is a load of cr*p.
One strike and your out!
Okay, since you misrepresent what I have said, I will reiterate it for you.
"I would also like to state that i have never at any time suggested zero tolerance " - and I never said that you did - I pointed out the original post which does call for Zero Tolerance.
My views on this gray area of teenage sex is also shared by people such as Terry Grange, a Chief Constable and also child protection spokesman for the Association of Chief Police Officers. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6163500.stm Still, what would he know about criminality?
"I believe that you should never gamble with childrens safety or lives and deciding who is low/medium/high risk is a load of cr*p."
Really think about this statement.
As you cited in an earlier example, a person who is abused as a child will occasionally grow up to abuse their own child / someone else's child.
On your suggestion, this would mean that he is a 'risk' to children. What do you suggest happen to the abused child?
"I would also like to state that i have never at any time suggested zero tolerance " - and I never said that you did - I pointed out the original post which does call for Zero Tolerance.
My views on this gray area of teenage sex is also shared by people such as Terry Grange, a Chief Constable and also child protection spokesman for the Association of Chief Police Officers. http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk/6163500.stm Still, what would he know about criminality?
"I believe that you should never gamble with childrens safety or lives and deciding who is low/medium/high risk is a load of cr*p."
Really think about this statement.
As you cited in an earlier example, a person who is abused as a child will occasionally grow up to abuse their own child / someone else's child.
On your suggestion, this would mean that he is a 'risk' to children. What do you suggest happen to the abused child?
Neilzulu1 Please stop misquoting me. I did not say that they will offend I said that they will occasionally.
To quote the person who you thought was '100% spot on':
"Fred West was sexually abused by his own mother when he was a child and then abused an 8 year old girl from a nearby farm in Herefordshire when he was in his mid teens. He then went on to abuse the women and children in his life and was in court accused of such an offence and got off with it. And as we know his offences escalated and resulted in many rapes/assaults/torture/violence/deaths."
Am also curious as to your qualifications to state that it is all boIIocks.
This New Scientist article shows brain changes in animals that abuse their offspring: http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn10430-ch ild-abuse-nature-or-nurture-.html
Still, I'm sure you know more than these scientists.
To quote the person who you thought was '100% spot on':
"Fred West was sexually abused by his own mother when he was a child and then abused an 8 year old girl from a nearby farm in Herefordshire when he was in his mid teens. He then went on to abuse the women and children in his life and was in court accused of such an offence and got off with it. And as we know his offences escalated and resulted in many rapes/assaults/torture/violence/deaths."
Am also curious as to your qualifications to state that it is all boIIocks.
This New Scientist article shows brain changes in animals that abuse their offspring: http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn10430-ch ild-abuse-nature-or-nurture-.html
Still, I'm sure you know more than these scientists.
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