ChatterBank47 mins ago
Do I Have to Believe Evolution?
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Well,For 116 years it graced the halls of the National Museum of Wales at Cardiff—the fossilised skeleton of a 200m[illion]-year-old predator that once cruised the Jurassic seas,” says Britain’s newspaper The Guardian. “Then curators at Cardiff decided the remains of the ocean-going carnivore ichthyosaurus needed a brush up—and realised that they had been taken in.” “When we stripped off five layers of paint we found it was an elaborate forgery,” said conservator Caroline Buttler. “It was an amalgam of two types of ichthyosaurus plus a clever attempt at fake parts.” Instead of disposing of it, the museum will put it on display as an example of a fake fossil.
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The diversity of debate on here is brilliant, DTcrosswordfan...no hassle in context I think your version was funnier.
Okay, just a tuppence worth: I first really came across this argument in secondary school, we had a set of twins in the Biology class who's parents had forced the school into agreeing that they could be ommitted from any classes that taught anything vaguely evolutionist, to the extent they took out court orders with the financial backing of their church, to me that mental.
I have no religious beliefs, I started asking questions at school and finished asking them a few years later when a minister told me it was okay that my son had died and it was God's purpose, that's boll0xs. However, from the age of about 4 I attended sunday school, bible classes and learnt the bible and what it said. By 13 I was teaching bible classes so I have a good idea where I'm coming from with this.
Religion is 99% rubbish and brainwashing no matter what creed it is, Christian, Jewish, Muslim you name it. However it is your own choice as to what you believe. Religion is a histioric way of controlling a populus and of forcing people to follow a uniform set of ideals, look at the Inquisition in the middle ages or any of the periods of ethnic cleansing we've seen over the years and it comes down to whomever is the strongest leader or the strongest religion as to who is the most successful.
Funny thing here though is that you can see evolution in action, survival of the strongest, the strongest faiths have survived by projecting their power over the people, generally by force. In the name of god and the pope, the Dominican Priests were sent forth to destroy heresy against the mother church, those who survived did by putting their faith in the priests.
I struggle with people who refuse to see the weight of evidence that proves a theory, the evidence can't break through the weight of brainwashing they have had. We were not placed here in 4004BC, god did not plant all the fossils of man and the dinosaurs for us to find a few thousand years later, we have not stopped changing and the earth is not flat. I can't tell someone what to believe but we can continue to try and convince people that their argumanets can never be backed up without the physical evidence to prove their voracity.
Lets add something current and another very heated debate on here on Global Warming. People are being drawn into the debate and brainwashed by the arguments for AGW yet their is still insufficient evidence to confirm any of it. The AGW Inquisition is ongoing now and anyone who declares a heretical view gets themselves lambasted in public by the slavish followers of the flawed AGW theory. How will this inquisition end? Well in my view it never will because we will always have someone trying to force their view on another, be grateful now though that much of it is done on message boards and forums where the power of words is all that you can use as your weapons.
Elderman, you believe what you feel is right but from this heretic please look inside yourself and keep asking why, if you can't be certain of your answer, keep asking questions.
Okay, just a tuppence worth: I first really came across this argument in secondary school, we had a set of twins in the Biology class who's parents had forced the school into agreeing that they could be ommitted from any classes that taught anything vaguely evolutionist, to the extent they took out court orders with the financial backing of their church, to me that mental.
I have no religious beliefs, I started asking questions at school and finished asking them a few years later when a minister told me it was okay that my son had died and it was God's purpose, that's boll0xs. However, from the age of about 4 I attended sunday school, bible classes and learnt the bible and what it said. By 13 I was teaching bible classes so I have a good idea where I'm coming from with this.
Religion is 99% rubbish and brainwashing no matter what creed it is, Christian, Jewish, Muslim you name it. However it is your own choice as to what you believe. Religion is a histioric way of controlling a populus and of forcing people to follow a uniform set of ideals, look at the Inquisition in the middle ages or any of the periods of ethnic cleansing we've seen over the years and it comes down to whomever is the strongest leader or the strongest religion as to who is the most successful.
Funny thing here though is that you can see evolution in action, survival of the strongest, the strongest faiths have survived by projecting their power over the people, generally by force. In the name of god and the pope, the Dominican Priests were sent forth to destroy heresy against the mother church, those who survived did by putting their faith in the priests.
I struggle with people who refuse to see the weight of evidence that proves a theory, the evidence can't break through the weight of brainwashing they have had. We were not placed here in 4004BC, god did not plant all the fossils of man and the dinosaurs for us to find a few thousand years later, we have not stopped changing and the earth is not flat. I can't tell someone what to believe but we can continue to try and convince people that their argumanets can never be backed up without the physical evidence to prove their voracity.
Lets add something current and another very heated debate on here on Global Warming. People are being drawn into the debate and brainwashed by the arguments for AGW yet their is still insufficient evidence to confirm any of it. The AGW Inquisition is ongoing now and anyone who declares a heretical view gets themselves lambasted in public by the slavish followers of the flawed AGW theory. How will this inquisition end? Well in my view it never will because we will always have someone trying to force their view on another, be grateful now though that much of it is done on message boards and forums where the power of words is all that you can use as your weapons.
Elderman, you believe what you feel is right but from this heretic please look inside yourself and keep asking why, if you can't be certain of your answer, keep asking questions.
Nice post Slapshot but you have the part about Global Warming completely backwards.
Like so much new science before it, the religious opposition is in denial of the evidence Everything from Evolution and Genetics through Relativity, Quantum Mechanics and Gender Equality has met with opposition from conservative forces.
The religion on this one is AGW Denial and the brainwashing is the attempt to wash away the scientific evidence. They even use pseudo scientific arguments just like those who denied before them. ANd like them they continue unabated when their "evidence" is demolished in front of them.
Like so much new science before it, the religious opposition is in denial of the evidence Everything from Evolution and Genetics through Relativity, Quantum Mechanics and Gender Equality has met with opposition from conservative forces.
The religion on this one is AGW Denial and the brainwashing is the attempt to wash away the scientific evidence. They even use pseudo scientific arguments just like those who denied before them. ANd like them they continue unabated when their "evidence" is demolished in front of them.
Elderman, you believe what you feel is right I do, but from this heretic please look inside yourself I have ,and keep asking why, People can't see I do.
Well most people are somewhat acquainted with a debate that started over one hundred years ago. The issue is this: Was man placed on earth as a special creation of God, as stated in the Bible? Or, has man evolved from a lower creature? Do not mistakenly think that this is a dead issue. Vigorous, even heated, language is still heard from both sides in this ongoing debate.
However, thousands of people who have heard arguments from both sides are not sure what to believe. Why? Because certain of the participants have confused them. In what way?
Well, the average person expects men of science to support .in evolution; most scientists, though not all, usually do. But, on the other hand, most people also ordinarily expect that religious leaders will uphold the belief that God created man, as taught in the Bible. But with growing frequency that is not the case.
It is of interest to set the teachings of Christendom’s churches alongside the Bible to see whether they agree. Such an examination will aid you to test your belief what is truth. 1 Thess. 5:21.
Christendom’s churches say: The human soul is immortal; it cannot die. The Bible says: is does.
Christendom’s churches say: The wicked will be tormented forever in a hell of fire. The Bible says: is does not
And one can go on and on of not the true teachings of the Bible.
Did those who later on accepted these teachings from atheists, “the universe is as it is, mysteriously, and it just happens to permit life,”. “Had it been different,” say atheists, “we would not be here to argue about it. The universe may or may not have a deep underlying unity, but there is no design, purpose, or point to it all. And theory of evolution “is more like a principle of medieval astrology than a serious . . . scientific theory.”
Well most people are somewhat acquainted with a debate that started over one hundred years ago. The issue is this: Was man placed on earth as a special creation of God, as stated in the Bible? Or, has man evolved from a lower creature? Do not mistakenly think that this is a dead issue. Vigorous, even heated, language is still heard from both sides in this ongoing debate.
However, thousands of people who have heard arguments from both sides are not sure what to believe. Why? Because certain of the participants have confused them. In what way?
Well, the average person expects men of science to support .in evolution; most scientists, though not all, usually do. But, on the other hand, most people also ordinarily expect that religious leaders will uphold the belief that God created man, as taught in the Bible. But with growing frequency that is not the case.
It is of interest to set the teachings of Christendom’s churches alongside the Bible to see whether they agree. Such an examination will aid you to test your belief what is truth. 1 Thess. 5:21.
Christendom’s churches say: The human soul is immortal; it cannot die. The Bible says: is does.
Christendom’s churches say: The wicked will be tormented forever in a hell of fire. The Bible says: is does not
And one can go on and on of not the true teachings of the Bible.
Did those who later on accepted these teachings from atheists, “the universe is as it is, mysteriously, and it just happens to permit life,”. “Had it been different,” say atheists, “we would not be here to argue about it. The universe may or may not have a deep underlying unity, but there is no design, purpose, or point to it all. And theory of evolution “is more like a principle of medieval astrology than a serious . . . scientific theory.”
Wow, this thread still active ???
The argument is dead from the point of view of those who do not have a treasured religious belief that contradicts it. I believe the evidence for evolution is beyond reasonable doubt. Debate these days remains for at least two reasons. One is that debate can be interesting for it's own sake. Especially if playing devil's advocate seriously. And two, there is a genuine concern that irrationality may get the upper hand in some areas, even if only for a limited period, so it is worth pointing out the difficulties with a creation viewpoint again and again in order to avoid the problems associated with a mass of folk who have taken things on trust because they may not had the issues explained to them.
The bible says the soul dies ? I had not realised that. What reasons does it give for the destruction of a soul ?
If it comes to that what evidence does Christendom give for the existence of a Hell and everlasting torment ?
The way a physical universe develops has no bearing on whether there is a spiritual realm or not. The two are different issues. And it is difficult to see how one can test to prove or disprove one from the other.
Oh and in what way does a tested and proven beyond doubt theory relate to astrology ?
The argument is dead from the point of view of those who do not have a treasured religious belief that contradicts it. I believe the evidence for evolution is beyond reasonable doubt. Debate these days remains for at least two reasons. One is that debate can be interesting for it's own sake. Especially if playing devil's advocate seriously. And two, there is a genuine concern that irrationality may get the upper hand in some areas, even if only for a limited period, so it is worth pointing out the difficulties with a creation viewpoint again and again in order to avoid the problems associated with a mass of folk who have taken things on trust because they may not had the issues explained to them.
The bible says the soul dies ? I had not realised that. What reasons does it give for the destruction of a soul ?
If it comes to that what evidence does Christendom give for the existence of a Hell and everlasting torment ?
The way a physical universe develops has no bearing on whether there is a spiritual realm or not. The two are different issues. And it is difficult to see how one can test to prove or disprove one from the other.
Oh and in what way does a tested and proven beyond doubt theory relate to astrology ?
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