forced and arranged marriages

[nailit]

Given the recent media coverage of kids as young as 5 been forced into muslim marriages can anyone tell me, is this practice condoned in the koran or is it a cultural thing?
Also, do people who practice this kind of thing have any sense of love and affection?
I dont want an anti islam thread here, Im just curious as to why anyone would want to marry a 5 year old girl. Im well aware that in years gone by that child marriage existed in the UK. Still cant get my head around it though, just because it once happened here.
Thanks.

[naomi24]

Keyplus, you posted a link to this same tatty little website only a little while ago. One look at it will tell anyone with any sense it’s just more apologist nonsense.

As for twisting words, no one has twisted yours. You’ve made your views quite clear, and nothing can excuse them.

[keyplus90]

Fender - You are just a father? Then read all of that link instead of just relying on something that you have already decided to believe in as I have nothing else to say about this subject as someone else has explained in more details than I could.

[vetuste_ennemi]

Don’t bother with the link, Fender.
Here is a direct quote:
<<It is important to know that girls during the Biblical and Islamic days used to be married off at young ages when they either had their first periods, or their breasts start showing off. In other words, when they turn into "women", then they get married off. It was quite different for men on the other hand, because physical power and the ability of living an independent life had always been and will always be a mandatory requirement for men to have in life. So men waited much longer than women in terms of getting married. The guy had to develop both his body and mind before he was ready for marriage. That is why you see girls as young as 9 or 10 were married to men as old as 30 or even older. The culture back then and in many third world countries today (NON-MUSLIM ONES TOO) is quite different than what you live in today. Prophet Muhammad's marriage with Aisha was 100% legal and acceptable by all laws and Divine Religions! So to call Prophet Muhammad a pedophile for marrying a girl that was OFFERED TO HIM by her parents and was accepted by all of the people back then including the enemies of Islam, the pagans, is quite absurd>>
Apart from the third sentence (which seems to suggest that the ability to live an independent life is an optional extra for half the human race) the argument has some merit. What doesn’t have merit is the implication that these laws and customs should be imposed on us today, which is the agenda of many ignorant third-world Muslims and of a few semi-educated Western ones. That they were acceptable then does not mean they should be acceptable now. The fundamentalists don’t get this. Indeed they can’t, having painted themselves into a corner with their belief that everything the messenger did had to be right.
Ah, there’s another argument: the Jews did it, the Byzantines did it, therefore it was OK for Mohammed to it. Quod erat demonstrandum.
Doncha luvvit! Keep the faith, Fender.

[naomi24]

Keyplus, explain why you think little girls become women the moment they have their first period. According to that, one day they’re children – the next - Bingo! - they’re women! Speaking from personal experience, it simply doesn’t work that way. The only change that occurs to a little girl's body at that time is that she experiences her first period. Nothing else changes. Apart from that, she is exactly the same today as she was yesterday – she is still a child - and she still has a very long way to go before she becomes a fully developed woman. Additionally, it doesn’t work from an intellectual, psychological, or emotional perspective because, I assure you, there’s no instant change there either. Perhaps you should speak to your English wife about it, because you certainly need educating on the subject.

[beso]

Mohammed's pedophilic marriage is held up as justification for the practice in the modern world. They also claim it was OK because the girls's parents "offered" her to him.

This practice is entrenched in the concept that the child is a mere possession of the parents who have the right to hand over her liberty as they wish. Those stupid enough to adopt the primitive sense of morality invented by ignorant men many centuries ago also justify the oppression of women in the same way.

[sith123]

naomi, it is so funny you do not want to admit you made a mistake. i mean seriously, if i was even answering your question it is clear that my answer is a no, i wouldnt do it, however the fact is it is not compulsory. No one makes you and tells you to do it and the majority do not do it. But as you are a typical atheist you will ignore that completely and look straight at the few that do it and how the media picks it up.

Also you think that people encourage it. That is completely wrong. There are serious punishments in Asian and Arab countries, as well as a few African. But again, you will not listen to that. The only thing you would listen to is what suits you and what you like.

[naomi24]

Sith, I’ve already given you the benefit of the doubt. You wouldn’t do it, but you haven’t objected to others doing it. You haven’t said it’s wrong.

So Sith, is it wrong? A straight answer would be good.

You’ve already said there are punishments – if it goes against the girl’s wish.

//If it goes against the girls wish than there is punishment in Arab and Asia.//

I’ll ask you again. How on earth can a nine year old child make an informed decision on marriage? Again, a straight answer would be good.

[sith123]

there is no straight answer to this question, and if you think that is silly i can give you a variety of questions where there is no straight answer. Questions that even the "great Naomi" wouldn't be able to answer.

First of all, youre the one who always goes on about how times are changing, and that happened ages ago, back then there were different views on marriage. Also he was the prophet and was seen as special. of course you would make fun of this but to be honest naomi i dont really care right now because that is your problem, not mine. Also look at how many people in the world do this. The majority, the vast majority do not and if you asked them they would not anticipate on doing it, but as usual like everything else the media will pick up the minority to just make themselves a "good story" when in fact if you looked at it on a larger scale marriage as young as this rarely happens. Again you may say you know people who do, i dont care as all im focused on is answering your question, not playing childish games and trying to make the others seem like fools which you do. you may not admit it but you do. Also yes, in some countries they do it more than others however that is mainly tradition, culture and custom and if you asked them they may seem normal about it, some of the girls might laugh at how late people in Britain get married. Not everyone follows Britains rules and not everyone has to think that British rules are the only rules that are correct. bare in mind i am British, i was born here so im not poking fun.

I will not give a straight answer and to be honest i do not care how much you try to make me or any other religious person on here whose views oppose yours or are different as i have answered the question already. If you want to waste your time trying to get an answer that is right according to your beliefs than by all means keep trying. However my answer is clear. I would not do it, or marry a nine year old or marry a nine year old off in my family however that doesnt mean it does not happen and in some countries it may be considered normal. yes if it goes against there will or against law in the country than yes, it is wrong. I WOULD NOT DO IT HOWEVER. That is my answer. (bare in mind i put it in capitals so it is clear to you naomi what my answer is. we wouldnt want you getting confused again would we?)

[naomi24]

Sith, // I will not give a straight answer//

You just did. You wouldn’t do it, but you can’t - and won't - say it’s wrong for other people to do it. No confusion there.

[sith123]

good. So i have then given an answer. Lets see how long it is before naomi asks again. As she has said i have given an answer, so no more trouble.

[sith123]

yes, naomi, but than can you explain why i said what i said. Lets see if you make up a load of mumble jumble or actually use my words because what i said is pretty self explanatory.

[naomi24]

Sith, what you said is absolutely self-explanatory. You wouldn’t do it, but you you can’t - and won't - say it’s wrong for other people to do it. As I said, no confusion there.

//can you explain why i said what i said.//

No, I can’t explain it because I don’t understand the mentality of a man who does not condemn people who sexually abuse children.

[sith123]

...than obviously you have not read my answer.

[naomi24]

Yes I have.

[sith123]

so basically naomi you are doing what you usually critisize me on. Answering a question without explanation. typical.

[naomi24]

Sith, what are you talking about now? I've read your answer. What's to explain?

[sith123]

why you think my views are like that

//No, I can’t explain it because I don’t understand the mentality of a man who does not condemn people who sexually abuse children.//

as you would say to me, not a good enough answer.

Also i want to point out that have you also actually read the overall thread question as it clearly states //I dont want an anti islam thread here//.

obviously that is not the case.

[naomi24]

Sith, go and talk to someone else. This is nonsense.