Remembrances

[Theland]

If you are an atheist, would you ever take part in a remembrance gathering , such as following the latest terrorist outrages in France?
If so, given your unbelief, what would be the point?

[beso]

Wasn't it was Gods plan that these people were murdered?

[atalanta]

Assuming that "remembrance" must necessarily have something to do with religion shows the usual huge logic gap so typical of religionists. Gaping holes in ones logic are only going to attract scorn and derision - on this site, at least.

[naomi24]

maggiebee, what are your reasons for attending such gatherings?

[goodlife]

Now let look at the the conscience. The Bible calls “a pure heart,” or ‘a clean heart.’ ( Matt. 5:8) This is a heart whose only motive and desire is to serve.

The reasonings of the heart deeply affect one’s conscience for good or for bad. So, if you examine your conscience and the way it operates you may discern the heart’s desires and motives.

We will see whether you have a good heart or a bad one.

Then you become aware of your moral obligations, you will be able to look into the workings of your heart and mind, and see the kind of person we truly are within.

Because you must know what in our heart if we want to train the conscience properly.

Jesus says “Out of the heart come wicked reasonings, murders, adulteries, fornications, thieveries, false testimonies, blasphemies. These are the things defiling a man.” (Matt. 15:18-20) Not only wicked reasonings that defile spring from the heart, but also virtues that purify. For Jesus said: “A good man brings forth good out of the good treasure of his heart, but a wicked man brings forth what is wicked out of his wicked treasure; for out of the heart’s abundance his mouth speaks.” (Luke 6:45)

So to improve your conscience and moral we must know and understand our heart.

The moral nature of the whole person. The conscience must do more than tell us what we ought to be; it must identify what we are in real life.

[Answerprancer]

It's ok, he's still thinking.

[Theland]

I have been fortunate enough to never have to have been in such public gatherings. Funerals, yes.
I see these things on tv and I suppose in that sense share in the horror.

[Theland]

Funny how an innocent post can generate such responses.

[Answerprancer]

Funny how so many thought-felt responses can generate such empty returns.

[Answerprancer]

"It's ok, he's still thinking".

...oh well, I lived in hope.

[Answerprancer]

Go on Theland, see if you can answer some of these responses to your "innocent post" ...step by step, succinctly. Cheat if you like: answer Goodlife at least!

[vulcan42]

" Funny how an innocent post can generate such responses."
Innocent!! you are very naive or very calculating. You remind me of a previous boss I had, at a meeting he would get a row started and then sit back and enjoy the conflict.

[Answerprancer]

...quite. I wonder though whether Theland is actually capable of chewing what he has seemingly bit off. My opinion is that most christians don't really philosophise because they're a bit thick.

[goodlife]

King Solomon made a careful investigation of human affairs along with atheist. He had the time, assets and insight to be thorough in his search

‘ For there is no more remembrance of the wise one than the stupid one to time indefinite. In the days that are already coming in, everyone is certainly forgotten; and how will the wise one die? Along with the stupid one.” (Eccl. 2:14-16)

[vulcan42]

" King Solomon made a careful investigation of human affairs along with atheist."
From what you have written goodlife, King Solomon had atheists helping him with his investigation, no wonder it was successful.

[Hypognosis]

@Theland

It would seem duplicitous to, as an atheist, attend a religion-based service of remembrance but, if it was for a family member, it would be churlish not to attend and who knows what after effects that might have, in terms with ongoing relationships with other branches of the family? Differences of opinion, over matters of faith, are not conducive to establishing new relationships with distant relatives, who you do not know well, or avoiding deterioration of relationships with the ones you do know well.

This is why I dislike seeing atheist/theist debate descending into exchanges of words, impugning another's intelligence, because this had irreverdibly altered the simple statement "I'm an atheist, actually", in casual conversation, to an unspoken but implied "I'm an atheist, actually {and you're stupid for holding any belief, contrary to mine}". Easy to do, from behind the cloak of anonymity offered by social media and no love lost, where total strangers are on the receiving end but inadvisable when it comes to the extended family. That said, once put on the spot by a direct question, from one of them, there's no evading it.

You have focused on a post-terrorism remembrance and, if I happened to be passing the site at the right moment, I would certainly drop what I was doing and join in. In practice though, it would be more likely that I would remain at home, for no better reason than I was unaware of what was planned or in the process of happening. By the time I'd seen it on the TV news, it would probably have ended before I could get there.

Joining in would, however, be merely an act of solidarity with the wider community. If none of the victims were people I knew, personnally, there would be a nagging sense of being an imposter, rather as you might, were you to attend the funeral of a (non-celebrity) person, who you never knew.

From the spirituality angle, I see remembrance as only that - remembering the person we've lost. I mourn the fact that their enjoyment of life has ceased, not the fact that I can no longer draw enjoyment from their company. What I certainly don't do is celebrate their moving on to a better place. For atheists, there is not that softening of the blow. We celebrate life and thus mourn its end, perhaps more painfully than do people of faith.

[Hypognosis]

@Theland

Remembrance, in the long term is an odd thing. If you've not researched your family tree, think about how much you remember of your grandparents and compare that to how well you remember your great-granparents. That is some indication of how good, or not, family memory is and how well you are likely to be remembered.

Times change, though, and technology will give your descendants an unprecedented ability to know you well. You lucky thing. ;-)

[Theland]

Thank you Hypo. Very thoughtful and civil of you.
I never thought a casual question would begin from some such demands for a forensic answer to the points THEY raised.
Hey! It's only a bit of light conversation over a cup of cyber coffee.
No biggee.

[maggiebee]

naomi24 my reasons for attending these gatherings is the same reason I attend church every Sunday and often throughout the week too. I believe in Jesus Christ as my saviour and am not afraid to stand up and be counted. I call it faith - no proof, just a very strong conviction.

[naomi24]

maggiebee, what does that have to do with attending Remembrance gatherings?

[maggiebee]

Sorry Naomi - I think you know very well why I would take part in remembrance services - it's out of respect and it matters not a whit whether I am a Christian or an atheist. I just happen to be a Christian.