jesus

[Le Chat]

The Bible aside, is there any other historical documented fact that Jesus existed? 

[Clanad]

Sure...Josephus, Tacitus, Suetonius, et al.

For a reasoned discussion of these and others check here...

http://www.rationalchristianity.net/jesus_extrabib.html

[dave_c]

Roman documentation of the crucifixion?

[EssJay1]

I think the only "fact" about Jesus which can be disputed is whether he rose from the dead - that is a matter of faith. (Oh and the VIrgin birth.) I even have a feeling that many of the healing miracles can be explained in scientific terms.

[Oneeyedvic]

I'm sorry are you asking if a person called Jesus existed or are you asking if Jesus was the Son of God?

 

Personally speaking, although I have never read any documents referred to above, I would (on the balance of probability) agree that a perosn called Jesus existed in or around 0 BC.

I would not agree that this person was the Son of God though.

 

 

You also say "The Bible aside".....does this mean that you agree It or are you looking for further proof?

[Peter Pedant]

The site is quite good - and there are not many references to Jesus.

The Josephus quotation I thought, was thought to be an interpolation. That is a monk copyist slipped in the reference between when J wrote and AD2000

The other references are to Christians - I think everyone accepts that nero (qualis artifex pereo!) blamed the christians for the burning of rome - but that is not the same as proving the existence of someone called jesus let alone whether or not he was the Son of Man.

The followers of Christ were called Christians from about 50AD. In fact one of the books of the NT is in ther because it records the first occurrence (James I think). The term was first coined for Christians at Antioch

Tell you what though, although Christos means anointed in Hebrew, Chreestos means useful in NT Greek, and this caused confusion in the first century AD, as Jesus was thought to be a (greek) slave since they often bore the name Chreestos.

Why do you have this wish for historial fact? The muslims believe that the prophet visited heaven on hte back of a horse Buraq. And that he leapt off on his journey from the Dome of the Rock in Jerusalem. You can go and see the Dome of the Rock, but this doesnt make islam any truer does it?

[Peter Pedant]

Oh I forgot,

Where Christ was scourged still exists.

He was scourged in the court yard of the castrum - the Roman Camp and that is now the courtyard of the convent of the Dames de Sion.

[arthurstace]

The Bible is a work of fiction, not a historical document.

[lea-lea]

It depends if your asking whether Jesus was a real person (mortal) or a 'god'? It's easier to find factual evidence that he was a mortal man. Anything that suggests he is a god is clearly not factual.

[Le Chat]

My question really has no hidden agenda! I merely wondered whether his life, or proof of his life, has/had ever been documented in any other source other than The Bible.

[RevShirls]

I agree with most of the above. There are references in a number of Ancient Near Eastern documents to the existence of the man called Jesus who is referred to in the Bible. Jesus is also mentioned in the Koran as a prophet - not as the Son of God.

I would have to take issue with BarbaraEllen about the Bible being a work of fiction, but I would agree that it is not a historical document, although it does contain much agreed historical perspective too. It is, rather, a theological document reflecting (some) people's understanding of God. In other words, those who wrote the Bible (which in itself is a library of books) regarded it to be the truth from their perspective.

[Weaza_cfc]

BarbaraEllen: in your opinion. Most admit most of it is symbolical or mythical, however many characters in the bible are pretty much considered real historical figures by most historians.

 

One such example is Jesus. He is mentioned in the text of other religions, even if not in the same revered light. Very few histoprians will dispute the fact that Jesus excisted. Whether he does the things it claims depends entirely on whether you are a literalist and your own personal beliefs

[Lord Copper]

No, the Bible is not proof either. Its fiction I'm afraid, he was no more the son of god than you or me. I'm afraid there is no proof that god exists either.

[jcherbstritt]

regardless of whether Jesus was the son of God or not, I would say it was highly unlikely that someone made him up.  Put it this way, does anyone know of another supposed historical figure that has become so famous, and so popular, and is still incredibly well known 2000 years later - who is merely a work of fiction?  Surely it would be very hard to make something up and be that good at it?

[Weaza_cfc]

Ok Lord Copper. I have no proof the bible is fact. But do you have undeniable proof that some of it isn't? Please note, kerris asks did Jesus excist, not is Jesus the Son of God. The two are totally different questions.  Remember that for a long time there was no proof that bacteria caused disease, or even excisted. And that turned to be bloody true.  

 

Apologies for the preachish rant. Will go and watch trassy TV now, with head hung in shame.

[Ive_changed]

Yes, they have found the cloth that Veronica, wiped Jesus's face with, and it dates back to that time.