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mikey4444
/// the more educated you are, the less you are liable to have any truck with superstitious nonsense. ///
Why does Christianity offend you so much? Surely as long as a persons beliefs are not harming you physically or is ever likely to, why insult a person's intelligence just because they choose to follow Christianity?
Such insults only brings into question not only the type of person you are but also your own level of education.
/// the more educated you are, the less you are liable to have any truck with superstitious nonsense. ///
Why does Christianity offend you so much? Surely as long as a persons beliefs are not harming you physically or is ever likely to, why insult a person's intelligence just because they choose to follow Christianity?
Such insults only brings into question not only the type of person you are but also your own level of education.
Yes we must act now to stop the nutters.
No, Islam has nothing to do with the decline of Christianity.
I suspect we will see a decline in Muslims going to the Mosque regularly in the West. Already I have friends who dont go and my daughters have 'muslim' frielnds who go to the pub and eat pork.
Why has it not declined faster? I suspect because strict parents coming over had no other knowledge of anything else, bit by bit girls and boys will want to emulate the majortiy of friendsso will drift away from this.
Of course, Blair & Bottlers multicultural experiment has a lot to answer for in trapping young people into the cycle. Where youngsters do not see friends from other backgrounds, they too will be blinkered.
Thank you His Tonyness.
No, Islam has nothing to do with the decline of Christianity.
I suspect we will see a decline in Muslims going to the Mosque regularly in the West. Already I have friends who dont go and my daughters have 'muslim' frielnds who go to the pub and eat pork.
Why has it not declined faster? I suspect because strict parents coming over had no other knowledge of anything else, bit by bit girls and boys will want to emulate the majortiy of friendsso will drift away from this.
Of course, Blair & Bottlers multicultural experiment has a lot to answer for in trapping young people into the cycle. Where youngsters do not see friends from other backgrounds, they too will be blinkered.
Thank you His Tonyness.
AOG - "andy-hughes
/// It is the result of indifference, irrelevance, and the inability of the Church to drag itself away from its twelfth century idolatory, hypocracy, abuse of power, and general serial unpleasantness. ///
And as if Islam is living in the 21st century? At least Western Christianity has learnt over the years to stop behaving in a barbaric way, unlike Islam which is still practising their barbarous and savage ways.
If this is your attempt to shy us away from any criticism of Islam, you have failed miserably."
I wqould totally dispure that Western Christianity 'has learned to stop behaving in a barbaric way'.
My point was not one of comparisons of bad behaviour, but if it were, the abuses carried out under the guise of Christianity, aside from the issue of constant and unacknowledged child abuse would certainly stack up against anything that the wider Muslim faith can do in its own name.
I am not getting into an argument about extremist doctrine and behaviour on either side - that is not the issue under debate here.
It is certainly not my attempt to "shy you away from any criticism of Islam...".
If you want to criticise Islam, or any other faith, feel free, my only argument will be if i think your cricitism is unfair, in which case we can debate.
But as far as defending Islam from criticism per se, that's not my remit - I do not worship in that faith, I have no axe to grind either way.
/// It is the result of indifference, irrelevance, and the inability of the Church to drag itself away from its twelfth century idolatory, hypocracy, abuse of power, and general serial unpleasantness. ///
And as if Islam is living in the 21st century? At least Western Christianity has learnt over the years to stop behaving in a barbaric way, unlike Islam which is still practising their barbarous and savage ways.
If this is your attempt to shy us away from any criticism of Islam, you have failed miserably."
I wqould totally dispure that Western Christianity 'has learned to stop behaving in a barbaric way'.
My point was not one of comparisons of bad behaviour, but if it were, the abuses carried out under the guise of Christianity, aside from the issue of constant and unacknowledged child abuse would certainly stack up against anything that the wider Muslim faith can do in its own name.
I am not getting into an argument about extremist doctrine and behaviour on either side - that is not the issue under debate here.
It is certainly not my attempt to "shy you away from any criticism of Islam...".
If you want to criticise Islam, or any other faith, feel free, my only argument will be if i think your cricitism is unfair, in which case we can debate.
But as far as defending Islam from criticism per se, that's not my remit - I do not worship in that faith, I have no axe to grind either way.
Judging by some of the answers on here, Islam has no problem of taking over, there would be no opposition, the atheist would hold their hands up in pathetic surrender.
Gone would be Church marriages, (that is if some would bother to marry), in fact gone would be all our Norman and Saxon village churches and our beautiful English cathedrals, all turned into Tescos or Mosques.
Gone would be Church marriages, (that is if some would bother to marry), in fact gone would be all our Norman and Saxon village churches and our beautiful English cathedrals, all turned into Tescos or Mosques.
AOG - "Judging by some of the answers on here, Islam has no problem of taking over, there would be no opposition, the atheist would hold their hands up in pathetic surrender."
I don't undersnad why atheists, of which I am one, would be 'surrendering'?
This is not a war for hearts and minds, where one 'side' 'wins', so where does surrender come into it.
I have no problem per se with Muslims, or with Christians - just major issues with the Catholic faith based on personal experience.
So i won't be 'surendering' any time soon.
Thank you.
I don't undersnad why atheists, of which I am one, would be 'surrendering'?
This is not a war for hearts and minds, where one 'side' 'wins', so where does surrender come into it.
I have no problem per se with Muslims, or with Christians - just major issues with the Catholic faith based on personal experience.
So i won't be 'surendering' any time soon.
Thank you.
Neither will I Andy ! I have never seen the need to defend my atheism and see no need to start now. People can worship how they like as long as it doesn't bother me. I used to be plagued by JW's pestering me on a Saturday morning but since I learned the secret words to use, I haven't been bothered since.
We still get the young American Boys, trying to flog Mormonism but they are easy to deal with, as I found out when I answered to door to them once, in ill-fitting Y-fronts !
We still get the young American Boys, trying to flog Mormonism but they are easy to deal with, as I found out when I answered to door to them once, in ill-fitting Y-fronts !
/// If you want to criticise Islam, or any other faith, feel free, my only argument will be if i think your cricitism is unfair, in which case we can
debate. ///
/// But as far as defending Islam from criticism per se, that's not my remit - I do not worship in that faith, I have no axe to grind either way. ///
Then Andy perhaps you and others should have addressed the Express headline, instead of turning the thread into a criticism of Christianity, and just to remind you here is the headline.
*** The end of Christianity? Why we must act NOW to stop Islamic State before it's too late ***
debate. ///
/// But as far as defending Islam from criticism per se, that's not my remit - I do not worship in that faith, I have no axe to grind either way. ///
Then Andy perhaps you and others should have addressed the Express headline, instead of turning the thread into a criticism of Christianity, and just to remind you here is the headline.
*** The end of Christianity? Why we must act NOW to stop Islamic State before it's too late ***
AOG - "Then Andy perhaps you and others should have addressed the Express headline, instead of turning the thread into a criticism of Christianity, and just to remind you here is the headline.
*** The end of Christianity? Why we must act NOW to stop Islamic State before it's too late *** "
Please allow me to address the Express headline -
The day I take the remotest notice of anything a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express has to say will never come.
Is that addressed sufficiently?
*** The end of Christianity? Why we must act NOW to stop Islamic State before it's too late *** "
Please allow me to address the Express headline -
The day I take the remotest notice of anything a right-wing tittle-tattle scaremongering rag like the Daily Express has to say will never come.
Is that addressed sufficiently?
andy-hughes
/// just major issues with the Catholic faith based on personal experience. ///
As you know I am not in the habit of being personal, but please excuse me this time.
Since you have often stated that your wife is a devoted Catholic and you also go along with her to Mass, I do hope that your relationship with your wife is not the 'major personal experience issues' that you are referring to?
/// just major issues with the Catholic faith based on personal experience. ///
As you know I am not in the habit of being personal, but please excuse me this time.
Since you have often stated that your wife is a devoted Catholic and you also go along with her to Mass, I do hope that your relationship with your wife is not the 'major personal experience issues' that you are referring to?
AOG - thank you for your sensitive approach - appreciated.
No, my, and more imprtantly her, experience was during her days as a Head teacher attempting to deal with the issue of an abusive member of staff.
To cut a long story short, the Christian Brothers closed ranks (and their eyes!) and a proposed court case did not proceede.
It was a terribly difficult time for my family - lasting over twelve months, and resulting in my wife's early retirement from ill health, pnseumonia, and thence ME which will be with her for life.
The Christian Brothers did not even manage a phone call when she was in hospital, or a 'thank you and goodbye' letter when she left their employment.
Her faith was seriously damaged, and may not have entirely recovered.
I have no faith, but remain apoplectic with anger at the way she was treated - which I freely admit colours my position on the Catholic church.
No, my, and more imprtantly her, experience was during her days as a Head teacher attempting to deal with the issue of an abusive member of staff.
To cut a long story short, the Christian Brothers closed ranks (and their eyes!) and a proposed court case did not proceede.
It was a terribly difficult time for my family - lasting over twelve months, and resulting in my wife's early retirement from ill health, pnseumonia, and thence ME which will be with her for life.
The Christian Brothers did not even manage a phone call when she was in hospital, or a 'thank you and goodbye' letter when she left their employment.
Her faith was seriously damaged, and may not have entirely recovered.
I have no faith, but remain apoplectic with anger at the way she was treated - which I freely admit colours my position on the Catholic church.
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