News1 min ago
In Or Out? (Of the EU)
This poll is closed.
With renewed talk about an in/out EU referendum, how would you vote, given the simple choice of:
- Get Out Of The EU - 104 votes
- 62%
- Stay In The EU - 63 votes
- 38%
Stats until: 11:41 Thu 21st Nov 2024 (Refreshed every 5 minutes)
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Why Naomi ! If people can lie, or feel "shy" when asked to give their opinion, why might it not be happening in this Poll ? Why were Labour voters not "shy" when Polled a few weeks ago ?
Only a very few people has responded to Eds Poll, and they are the usual suspects...ie you, me, and all the other regulars on here. When Polling companies poll, they usually have a sample of about 1000-2000. Why is ours more accurate ?
Only a very few people has responded to Eds Poll, and they are the usual suspects...ie you, me, and all the other regulars on here. When Polling companies poll, they usually have a sample of about 1000-2000. Why is ours more accurate ?
There are several reasons to think that we'll vote to stay in the EU despite what the AB poll says. The vote to stay in is "yes", and that allows the campaign to be run as a positive message. The vote to stay in is a vote for the status quo, and this too is likely to provide a late boost to the staying-in campaign. And then of course the AB poll is hardly statistically sound. That it came close to the actual result is almost certainly coincidence.
All the same, it's clear that there is plenty of work to do if the UK is to remain in the EU. Good. It should be a tough campaign that could go either way.
All the same, it's clear that there is plenty of work to do if the UK is to remain in the EU. Good. It should be a tough campaign that could go either way.
“Why were Labour voters not "shy" when Polled a few weeks ago ?”
It could be because of attitudes such as these, Mikey:
“One of the first things I did after seeing the depressing election news this morning was check to see which of my Facebook friends ‘like’ the pages of the Conservatives or David Cameron, and unfriend them. I don’t want to be friends with racists, sexists, or homophobes. And I don’t want to be friends with Conservatives either.”
(Rebecca Roache, Royal Holloway University, writing of her disappointment and dismay at the election result.)
“I was surprised when I first heard that statistic. [that Labour has a smaller core following than the Conservatives]. Perhaps it is all the more surprising when we consider that voting conservative is largely socially unacceptable.”
(Dr Samuel Furse, post doctoral researcher at the University of Utrecht)
“Part of the reason for this shyness, it has to be said, is that people don’t like other people shouting “Tory scum” at them or vandalising their cars. And being a conservative, both big and small-C, has become so socially unacceptable that about one in eight Conservative voters routinely lie about it even when they are guaranteed anonymity by polling companies,..”
(The Catholic Herald)
“Right now I feel ashamed to be English. Ashamed to belong to a country that has clearly identified itself as insular, self-absorbed and apparently caring so little for the most vulnerable people among us.”
(Canon Giles Fraser, former chancellor of St Paul’s Cathedral, a position from which he resigned in protest at plans to remove forcibly the anti-capitalist protesters who had set up a ‘shanty town’ camp outside, writing in the Grauniad following the election results).
So there you have it. Voting Tory should make one ashamed of one’s country, is socially unacceptable and puts one on par with racists, sexists and homophobes. No real need the, to ask why some people are reluctant to make their political leanings known. Perhaps you could point me to some similar comments about people who vote Labour.
It could be because of attitudes such as these, Mikey:
“One of the first things I did after seeing the depressing election news this morning was check to see which of my Facebook friends ‘like’ the pages of the Conservatives or David Cameron, and unfriend them. I don’t want to be friends with racists, sexists, or homophobes. And I don’t want to be friends with Conservatives either.”
(Rebecca Roache, Royal Holloway University, writing of her disappointment and dismay at the election result.)
“I was surprised when I first heard that statistic. [that Labour has a smaller core following than the Conservatives]. Perhaps it is all the more surprising when we consider that voting conservative is largely socially unacceptable.”
(Dr Samuel Furse, post doctoral researcher at the University of Utrecht)
“Part of the reason for this shyness, it has to be said, is that people don’t like other people shouting “Tory scum” at them or vandalising their cars. And being a conservative, both big and small-C, has become so socially unacceptable that about one in eight Conservative voters routinely lie about it even when they are guaranteed anonymity by polling companies,..”
(The Catholic Herald)
“Right now I feel ashamed to be English. Ashamed to belong to a country that has clearly identified itself as insular, self-absorbed and apparently caring so little for the most vulnerable people among us.”
(Canon Giles Fraser, former chancellor of St Paul’s Cathedral, a position from which he resigned in protest at plans to remove forcibly the anti-capitalist protesters who had set up a ‘shanty town’ camp outside, writing in the Grauniad following the election results).
So there you have it. Voting Tory should make one ashamed of one’s country, is socially unacceptable and puts one on par with racists, sexists and homophobes. No real need the, to ask why some people are reluctant to make their political leanings known. Perhaps you could point me to some similar comments about people who vote Labour.
"I think people are sick of what has become the status quo..."
Possibly -- but typically, when it comes to the actual choice, we've almost always seen people going for the "safe" option. Leaving the EU would make for an uncertain future, and it will be hard for enough people to overcome that when it comes to the ballot box. Oh, and you can throw in the possible turmoil of whether the UK would survive long after a "no" vote into the equation, as Scotland is likely to vote to stay in apparently.
I'm not convinced an AB poll means anything really, but let say it is, and then assume a huge error of about 20% or so -- it indicates that the result could be very close.
Possibly -- but typically, when it comes to the actual choice, we've almost always seen people going for the "safe" option. Leaving the EU would make for an uncertain future, and it will be hard for enough people to overcome that when it comes to the ballot box. Oh, and you can throw in the possible turmoil of whether the UK would survive long after a "no" vote into the equation, as Scotland is likely to vote to stay in apparently.
I'm not convinced an AB poll means anything really, but let say it is, and then assume a huge error of about 20% or so -- it indicates that the result could be very close.
SNP might be the EU saving grace ?
"....EU referendum – proposal that there should be a double majority requirement, whereby each of the four constituent nations of the UK would have to vote for withdrawal before the UK as a whole could leave the EU..... "
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"....EU referendum – proposal that there should be a double majority requirement, whereby each of the four constituent nations of the UK would have to vote for withdrawal before the UK as a whole could leave the EU..... "
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In theory, such an idea would mean that everybody in England could turn up, vote to leave the EU, and produce once of the most spectacularly unanimous results in history. At the same time, a major distraction could stop all Scottish people voting save one, who votes to stay in. On such a result you would have a majority of around 40 million and apparently this wouldn't be enough.
Such a scenario wouldn't happen, of course. But that it is even theoretically possible shows how stupid the idea is. As long as Scotland is a member of the UK then it has to accept that it is a junior member and will not always get its way. This is how democracy works. Sometimes, you will not get what you want because other people want something else, and you have to accept that.
To take a more reasonable scenario, suppose the people of London, as a whole, vote to stay in the EU, but the rest of England as a whole votes to leave. That would lead most likely to an overall majority for leaving. Tough luck, then, Londoners -- you've been outvoted. As would Scotland be. If that happens, then people voting to stay in will have to lump it.
Such a scenario wouldn't happen, of course. But that it is even theoretically possible shows how stupid the idea is. As long as Scotland is a member of the UK then it has to accept that it is a junior member and will not always get its way. This is how democracy works. Sometimes, you will not get what you want because other people want something else, and you have to accept that.
To take a more reasonable scenario, suppose the people of London, as a whole, vote to stay in the EU, but the rest of England as a whole votes to leave. That would lead most likely to an overall majority for leaving. Tough luck, then, Londoners -- you've been outvoted. As would Scotland be. If that happens, then people voting to stay in will have to lump it.
With such a scanty supply of information, I can't see how anyone can vote with their head either way.
What is required is a itemised list of the characteristics of where exactly the UK would stand should it withdraw, all I have heard so far has been a rather vague outline of this from Nigel Farage, and lots of scaremongering from those opposed.
What is required is a itemised list of the characteristics of where exactly the UK would stand should it withdraw, all I have heard so far has been a rather vague outline of this from Nigel Farage, and lots of scaremongering from those opposed.
Yes quite so, jim.
There are no "constituent nations" of the UK. It is one sovereign state and the people of Scotland voted by a good margin on a high turnout to remain part of the UK just eight months ago. Scotland has no more right to demand such conditions than does London. Actually it has less because it contains far fewer people.
But such ridiculous demands are to be expected when the three minor "constituent nations" of the UK are being given to believe that they are separate from the UK. Difficulties (or, more precisely, ideas above their stations) such as these were bound to emerge as soon as the ridiculous devolution arrangements were begun. It is clear that the Wales, NI and (particularly) Scotland will make more and greater demands of the UK government to afford them special treatment and such is their belief in this entitlement that Scotland (8% of the population) thinks nothing of demanding a veto over a major constitutional issue which affects 100% of the people.
There are no "constituent nations" of the UK. It is one sovereign state and the people of Scotland voted by a good margin on a high turnout to remain part of the UK just eight months ago. Scotland has no more right to demand such conditions than does London. Actually it has less because it contains far fewer people.
But such ridiculous demands are to be expected when the three minor "constituent nations" of the UK are being given to believe that they are separate from the UK. Difficulties (or, more precisely, ideas above their stations) such as these were bound to emerge as soon as the ridiculous devolution arrangements were begun. It is clear that the Wales, NI and (particularly) Scotland will make more and greater demands of the UK government to afford them special treatment and such is their belief in this entitlement that Scotland (8% of the population) thinks nothing of demanding a veto over a major constitutional issue which affects 100% of the people.
I agree Khandro...a informed debate, followed by an informed vote is ideal.
But, as I have pointed out, we are unlikely to get much of that, as Europe is, and always has been, such an emotive issue, that any debate soon falls into wild scaremongering, from both sides. The Little Englanders want us to turn back to some mythical time, sometime in the early to mid 50's, where neither an foreign face was seen and nor a foreign voice heard.
There is also an element of " Well, I have made my mind up, now don't confuse me further with the facts" again, from both sides.
But, as I have pointed out, we are unlikely to get much of that, as Europe is, and always has been, such an emotive issue, that any debate soon falls into wild scaremongering, from both sides. The Little Englanders want us to turn back to some mythical time, sometime in the early to mid 50's, where neither an foreign face was seen and nor a foreign voice heard.
There is also an element of " Well, I have made my mind up, now don't confuse me further with the facts" again, from both sides.
"The Little Englanders want us to turn back to some mythical time, sometime in the early to mid 50's, where neither an foreign face was seen and nor a foreign voice heard. "
whereas the dyed in the wool lefties of your ilk are happy to see this countries identity, culture etc thrown away and the country handed over lock stock and barrel to people that do nothing except take from wherever they go.
People that want it all handed to them on a plate....youre the real danger to this country,even more so than the eussr and its empire building meglamaniacal grab of nations and its people...
whereas the dyed in the wool lefties of your ilk are happy to see this countries identity, culture etc thrown away and the country handed over lock stock and barrel to people that do nothing except take from wherever they go.
People that want it all handed to them on a plate....youre the real danger to this country,even more so than the eussr and its empire building meglamaniacal grab of nations and its people...
These motor plants wont survive here if we leave EU. They will move to Europe, taking jobs with them.
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