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Police Stifle Istanbul Gay Pride Rally
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Erdogan's very popular in Germany and Holland, I understand.
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//Because it's less political now, and more of a great day out.//
Ooohh how I laughed at that. Lets all have a great day out. What shall we do, a walk up Snowdon, a stroll along the cliffs of Dover, a long beach walk in Cornwall, white water rafting, paint balling? ..........Nahh not a big enough audience, how about a march through the center of a major city with lots of placards, and self serving chants and gestures.
Ooohh how I laughed at that. Lets all have a great day out. What shall we do, a walk up Snowdon, a stroll along the cliffs of Dover, a long beach walk in Cornwall, white water rafting, paint balling? ..........Nahh not a big enough audience, how about a march through the center of a major city with lots of placards, and self serving chants and gestures.
sp, So when you said …
// Could it be that in terms of real life prejudice and bigotry that gay people face - relatively little is from Muslims?//…
…. the real life work you’ve done hasn’t involved the problems gay Muslims experience from their own communities - which is clearly why you’ve encountered little prejudice and bigotry from Muslims.
// Could it be that in terms of real life prejudice and bigotry that gay people face - relatively little is from Muslims?//…
…. the real life work you’ve done hasn’t involved the problems gay Muslims experience from their own communities - which is clearly why you’ve encountered little prejudice and bigotry from Muslims.
The word 'gay' has changed meanings several times over the centuries.
It has variously meant 'happy and carefree', or 'addicted to pleasures and dissipations', 'rubbish and/or naff' and it has also been a noun for a man 'who consorts with (female) prostitutes'.
The word itself hasn't exactly been hijacked, it's just one of those words that different generations redefine.
It has variously meant 'happy and carefree', or 'addicted to pleasures and dissipations', 'rubbish and/or naff' and it has also been a noun for a man 'who consorts with (female) prostitutes'.
The word itself hasn't exactly been hijacked, it's just one of those words that different generations redefine.
Right - sorry to drop off naomi24.
What I need to explain is that the real life counselling I've done did involve Muslims. I heard their stories on a help line I volunteered for.
What I was referring to earlier is that most gay people in the U.K. experience homophobia from those of their own faith. What I've seen is that young gay Muslims don't face homophobia because by and large they don't come out. They make the mistake internalising, getting married etc.
So when you say:
//the real life work you’ve done hasn’t involved the problems gay Muslims experience from their own communities - which is clearly why you’ve encountered little prejudice and bigotry from Muslims.//
I see what you mean - all the Muslims I encounter don't have an issue with me because I'm 'other'. I am sure it would be entirely different if I was from a strict Muslim family. I agree with you there.
What I need to explain is that the real life counselling I've done did involve Muslims. I heard their stories on a help line I volunteered for.
What I was referring to earlier is that most gay people in the U.K. experience homophobia from those of their own faith. What I've seen is that young gay Muslims don't face homophobia because by and large they don't come out. They make the mistake internalising, getting married etc.
So when you say:
//the real life work you’ve done hasn’t involved the problems gay Muslims experience from their own communities - which is clearly why you’ve encountered little prejudice and bigotry from Muslims.//
I see what you mean - all the Muslims I encounter don't have an issue with me because I'm 'other'. I am sure it would be entirely different if I was from a strict Muslim family. I agree with you there.
sp1814
scooping
In fairness, Chechnya was introduced into the debate by -Talbot-, so it was only fair to point other anti-gay policies which have been promoted in Russia.
That's how this entered the thread.
Why do so many posters struggle to follow a thread?
Have another bash at who introduced Chechnya to the thread, sp.
Jim, it was obvious you had no idea Islam was the dominant religion in Chechnya. Sometimes it is best just to hold your hands up.
I would have people would still remember Beslan
scooping
In fairness, Chechnya was introduced into the debate by -Talbot-, so it was only fair to point other anti-gay policies which have been promoted in Russia.
That's how this entered the thread.
Why do so many posters struggle to follow a thread?
Have another bash at who introduced Chechnya to the thread, sp.
Jim, it was obvious you had no idea Islam was the dominant religion in Chechnya. Sometimes it is best just to hold your hands up.
I would have people would still remember Beslan
Thank you all for your comments. Will respond to some of the posts. Especially to SP and Jim who've made some interesting observations.
Somewhat surprised (given SP's post pointing out the obvious truth that distant concerns, however serious - like the hanging of gays in Iran or the Japanese tsunami - disturb us less than far more trivial local ones - like "he won't bake me a gay pride cake" or toothache) that the main point of the OP was missed.
"Very popular in Germany and Holland."
Coming to a town near you?
Somewhat surprised (given SP's post pointing out the obvious truth that distant concerns, however serious - like the hanging of gays in Iran or the Japanese tsunami - disturb us less than far more trivial local ones - like "he won't bake me a gay pride cake" or toothache) that the main point of the OP was missed.
"Very popular in Germany and Holland."
Coming to a town near you?
P: //v_e
I'll be honest - I didn't actually understand your OP.//
The reason I mentioned Germany and the Netherlands, SP, is that both countries have significant Turkish populations. Everyone's heard of the German "guest workers", but the Netherlands had the same system in the '60s and '70s. Many of the Dutch Turks have dual nationality, and there's been a bit of a diplomatic row caused in part by Erdogan's "interference" in the recent Dutch elections (he advised Dutch Turks to vote for a new Dutch-Turkish party), and in part by the Dutch government's barring Turkish politicians from addressing the expatriate community in order to get support in the Turkish referendum on the extension of presidential powers.
So while what happens in Erdogan's Turkey may not be relevant to anyone in the UK it may well have some relevance to countries with significant populations of Turks or people of Turkish descent. The most obvious case (which should concern you) is the rise of attacks on homosexuals in places like Amsterdam (although in all the reports I've read these have always been attributed to Moroccan gangs rather than Turkish ones).
This phenomenon is discussed (and "explained") in the "LGBT-related attitudes" section of this Wiki article:
https:/
I'll be honest - I didn't actually understand your OP.//
The reason I mentioned Germany and the Netherlands, SP, is that both countries have significant Turkish populations. Everyone's heard of the German "guest workers", but the Netherlands had the same system in the '60s and '70s. Many of the Dutch Turks have dual nationality, and there's been a bit of a diplomatic row caused in part by Erdogan's "interference" in the recent Dutch elections (he advised Dutch Turks to vote for a new Dutch-Turkish party), and in part by the Dutch government's barring Turkish politicians from addressing the expatriate community in order to get support in the Turkish referendum on the extension of presidential powers.
So while what happens in Erdogan's Turkey may not be relevant to anyone in the UK it may well have some relevance to countries with significant populations of Turks or people of Turkish descent. The most obvious case (which should concern you) is the rise of attacks on homosexuals in places like Amsterdam (although in all the reports I've read these have always been attributed to Moroccan gangs rather than Turkish ones).
This phenomenon is discussed (and "explained") in the "LGBT-related attitudes" section of this Wiki article:
https:/
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