Where Is The Real Fault Here?

[ToraToraTora]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-57260509
Could it possibly be our TROB approach to crime and non-punishment? Surely the savage should not have been out on the streets in the first place. Blaming the security services is like blaming the sheep dog for not rounding up all the sheep after you let them out.

[bednobs]

"we should change the law so these savages never see the light of day, end of."
isn't that what the government (of the last 11 years) are supposed to have done?

[andy-hughes]

TTT - // ... if only that were true, the rules only apply to some of us. //

Again a snarky and always unjustified dig.

You have been here long enough to know what the Site Rules are, and also to know that references to deleted posts are removed in order to help keep the thread on track.

[jourdain2]

burleyshirley 19.14 You asked when it all started and how we came to have so many Muslims here. I am open to correction, but in Bradford in the 1950s we were short of workers and my dad (wool sorter)noticed growing numbers of imported workers. He said they were good workers and very skilled. He saw no problem when their wives and families arrived. Bear in mind there were no Hal-al butchers and the girls wore ordinary school uniform, to my knowledge.

I think it was James Callaghan opened the gate to unrestricted access by all Commonwealth countries and then we seemed to lose the plot. Hope this helps.

[Mozz71]

//if only that were true, the rules only apply to some of us//

...aaaaand there we go with the "playing the victim" trope I was on about. I'd offer you a tissue, but I'm not sure I have "crocodile tears strength" ones to hand.

[ToraToraTora]

bednobs: "isn't that what the government (of the last 11 years) are supposed to have done?" - as I explained above they have only had enough majority to be able to do that since dec 2019 and they've had a lot on their plate since then in case you haven't noticed.

[andy-hughes]

naomi - // AH, if he killed because he was a psychopath you must concede that an awful lot of psychopaths adhere to Islam. //

I do concede that. I don't claim to have a reasoned answer as to why that is - i can only assume that there is some aspect of the character of Eastern peoples that gives them a propensity to take their religious teachings far more to heart certainly than Christians appear to do.

Unfortunately, that will lead to an extermist mindset which again may be part of the characteristics of certain races - I stress I am hypothesising here, I have no knowledge on which to base this notion.

// Furthermore, Islam cannot be compared to any other religion //

I think that applies to any and all religions.

// ... and until apologists acknowledge that, the world is fighting this appalling philosophy with one hand tied behind its back. People like you do no one except Islamic extremists any favours whatsoever - and they are laughing at you. //

Not being an 'apologist', I would not wish to appear to speak for them, so I will leave that there.

[Togo]

Another thread ruined with paralysis by analysis. Always the same couple of posters too.

[bednobs]

I'm not a great knowledge of the workings of government but are you suggesting that anyone other than conservative supporters would not support a reform of sentencing? Did the government even try?

[ToraToraTora]

bednobs: The wet tories + Labour + Lib non dems etc would block it, they love terrorists and criminals. To get that sort of reform through you need a sizeable majority to offset TROB.

[andy-hughes]

Togo - // Another thread ruined with paralysis by analysis. Always the same couple of posters too. //

The pleasure and displeasure in any and all threads is entirely a matter of perception and individual approach.

One person's analysis is another person's nitpicking, one person's paralysis is another person's discussion.

Takes all sorts as they say.

[bednobs]

And do they have a will to do you think?

[ToraToraTora]

maybe when they have time to do something other than the crisis.

[bednobs]

Do you have any idea what their manifesto says on the subject (I'm genuinely interested but not enough to actually read it :))

[ToraToraTora]

I doubt it went to that level of granularity.

[THECORBYLOON]

BEDNOBS, he's trying to avoid saying he has no idea.

[bednobs]

so maybe they dont have the will either?

[ToraToraTora]

there you go bednobs, fill yer boots
https://www.conservatives.com/our-plan

[THECORBYLOON]

He has no idea still.

Anyway BEDNOBS, in the recent Queen's Speech, one of the Bills to be considered was the Police, crime, sentencing and courts bill.

I've had a look and it does contain a section about the Secretary of State being able to refer high-risk offenders (so that would include terrorists for example) to the Parole Board rather than being given automatic parole.

I've not had a detailed look at it but if they're not included already, other measures, such as longer sentences for certain offences, could be added for debate along the way.

[bednobs]

thanks corby :)