Never Believe Anything Until It Has Been Officially Denied......

[ToraToraTora]

https://news.sky.com/story/labour-frontbencher-responds-to-sir-keir-starmers-eu-comment-backlash-12966978

So Rodders wants us back in the EUSSR - reminds me of a Beatles song!

[ToraToraTora]

gromit: "Starmer said he did not want to rejoin the bloc or join the single market. It is not an opinion to completely state the opposite" - yes it is an opinion to not believe that a politician really intends a certain action or lack of it. If you say you do not intend to do something it's not a lie to not believe that is it? A lie is saying something that at the time you say it, you personally know it is untrue. See if you can find me one of those.

[JDavis]

Oven-ready deal. If it wasn't a lie, Johnson's understanding was so poor that he was totally incapable of negotiating terms.

[ToraToraTora]

An intention, next!

[JDavis]

Saying it's oven-ready is stating a fact which he knows is wrong, not an intention. I know you don't really believe all the rubbish you post.

 

 

[ToraToraTora]

no it's not, it's a belief an intention. Next.

[ToraToraTora]

I least I know what a lie actually is. You 5C types seem to have a lot of literacy problems.

[JDavis]

Continuing to repeat it does not advance your argument. It is oven-ready suggests cooked (a past action) and ready to eat. That would be a fact. An intention would be to cook in the future. 

 

[Gromit]

// I least I know what a lie actually is. //

But you choose to believe lies and repeat them.

[ToraToraTora]

JDavis: "It is oven-ready suggests cooked (a past action) and ready to eat. That would be a fact. An intention would be to cook in the future. " - err no "oven ready" means ready for the oven, ie not cooked.  Have another go.

[Togo]

I cook. Oven ready means prepared for cooking. Oven cooked is ready for consumtion. It was not Boris's fault that the Brussels syndrome sufferers in the supposedly UK negotiations team kept turning the gas off and spoiling the ingrediants.  

[JDavis]

OK but oven ready still suggests the preparation has all been done (past tense). It obviously hadn't been. It's a deliberate lie characteristic of Johnson like saying all guidance was followed over partygate. You have to be very gullible (or bloody-minded) to interpret that as anything but the most convenient thing to say at the time rather than a true belief. 

[ToraToraTora]

JDavis, your cred has gone me old china, these literacy issues make it clear you have no idea.

[JDavis]

Always someone else's fault eh, Togo? Then Johnson should have known the perfidious nature of the EU and not counted his (oven-ready) chickens.

[JDavis]

TTT,

In other words, you have no rational argument left.

 

 

 

 

[ToraToraTora]

A lie is something said that the person saying it knows is untrue at the time they say it. My hair is green that's a lie, geddit? Now find me one of those.

[JDavis]

Your hair may well be green for all I know, so that may not be a lie.  To get back to the original point, Johnson knew the deal wasn't oven-ready but, as with his whole career, found it easier to lie. If he really did believe it, he was totally unfit to be negotiating.

[Gromit]

Johnson: No Lockdown rules were broken at No10.

Police: Here are 55 fines for breaking Lockdown rules at No.10. You can contest the fines if you think you are innocent.

Johnson, Sunak, Carrie and 52 others: We are not contesting the fines.

[ToraToraTora]

17:15 Whether something is oven ready is purely subjective and cannot be a lie. You didn't even know what "oven ready" meant an hour ago. Now surely if you are convinced BJ is such a liar then you must be able to find a better clear cut example.

[naomi24]

The original point is Starmer has put his foot in it and is now doing his best to pretend he hasn't.

[ToraToraTora]

gromit:

"Johnson: No Lockdown rules were broken at No10." - an opinion and still a matter of some debate.

"Police: Here are 55 fines for breaking Lockdown rules at No.10. You can contest the fines if you think you are innocent.

Johnson, Sunak, Carrie and 52 others: We are not contesting the fines." - it was easier just to pay them, the fact is that it was not clear cut. It was allowed to have gatherings with work colleagues at the place of work. If it did go to court I think a decent lawyer would get it thrown out, they paid to avoid the agro.

....next.