Will it all fall on deaf ears?

[anotheoldgit]

http://tinyurl.com/2u2do7y

David Cameron tells us that the terrorist threat to Britain is "as serious as it has ever been".

/// He also suggests that Britain faces fundamental questions about why young Muslims continue to be drawn into violent extremism. The Islamic community must help address how their minds are "poisoned", he says. ///

Will the indigenous population sit up and take notice, let alone the moderate Islamic community?

[naomi24]

Islamic Centre chairman Qadeer Baksh said: //‘The reason we didn’t take the Government money for the Preventing Violent Extremism scheme is that it requires us to inform on fellow Muslims. //

That seems clear enough to me.

[jno]

not a fan of informers myself (the Nazis loved them, of course), though given the eagerness of Brits to spy on one another via CCTVs and so on, I suspect I'm in a minority.

[anotheoldgit]

jno

So if your next door neighbour was up to something dodgy (no matter what) you would no inform on him?

[Rasman]

//not a fan of informers myself (the Nazis loved them, of course), though given the eagerness of Brits to spy on one another via CCTVs and so on, I suspect I'm in a minority. //

JNO, How on earth can you compare British security with the Nazi regime?
If you weren't so established on this site I'd call you a troll.
You do seem to suspend common sense in order to post deliberately inflammatory comments.

[naomi24]

Rasman, you'll often find jno suspends common sense when religion is involved. In her eyes the religious can do no wrong.

[sandyRoe]

Denouncing people to the police isn't the British way. Particularly when there isn't any real evidence that the person accused has done anything wrong.

[naomi24]

The British way? What utter tripe! Unfortunately the people we're talking about don't appreciate, or play by the British way. The mind truly boggles!

[jno]

it wasn't just Nazis; the Soviet Union, East Germany and the Stasi, the Khmer Rouge, the Vichy regime in France - all relied heavily on informers. But I wasn't actually talking about the regimes but about the people who are so ready to do their informing for them. As sandyRoe correctly says, denouncing people used not to be the British way.

Would I report to the police if I saw someone committing a crime, aog? Yes. If I just heard him making some religious statement I disapproved of? Nope.

But of course I'm not British, so I don't have this urge to tell tales to matron.

[DaisyNonna]

Matron? Presupposes public school? Hospital Background? Married woman?

Purlease explain.

[naomi24]

jno ....no doubt even if that religious statement indicates the speaker intends to murder thousands of innocent people in the name of Allah. Smart. As Rasman says, you do seem to suspend common sense at times.

[naomi24]

Daisy, I think the Matron bit is jno's attempt to ridicule the British with a reference to the Carry On movies. Not funny when we're talking about national security, and certainly not clever, but there you have it.

[sandyRoe]

This man probably talked politics in the mosque. His politics are very different from ours.
Even if he had been denounced there's no saying he would have been stopped. The security services had not considered one of the London bombers worthy of closer attention. He was 'on their radar'.

[naomi24]

Hello Sandy, no there is no saying he would have been stopped, but that doesn't mean we should ignore it - and the very reason we shouldn't ignore is because his politics are very different from ours. We ignore these people at our peril.

[sandyRoe]

Evening Naomi. This man is of the same ilk as the shoe bomber and the doctors who made the attack on Glasgow airport. They are a greater danger to themselves than to anyone else.
The real danger for us is in Pakistan and Saudi Arabia. It was in Pakistan that the London bombers learned their murderous skills.

[naomi24]

Oh I agree with you Sandy - except that I don't even think about these people being a greater danger to themselves. I don't give a hoot what they do to themselves - just as long as they don't do the same to anyone else.

[birdie1971]

Jno - “Would I report to the police if I saw someone committing a crime, aog? Yes. If I just heard him making some religious statement I disapproved of? Nope. But of course I'm not British, so I don't have this urge to tell tales to matron.”


I find it hard to believe that you typed that utter tripe.

What on earth were/are you thinking? We're talking about an extremist radical muslim and you seem to think that reporting him to the authorities is 'telling tales to matron'. What you are suggesting is that religious radicals who make themselves know in their community should not be reported to the authorities because to do so would be bad form. You utter imbecile. Taimour Abdulwahab Al-Abdaly wasn't reported because the leaders of the Luton Islamic Centre stated that they did not want to inform the authorities on their 'muslim brothers and sisters' and this Jno, is something that you apparently approve of.

Shame on you.

[sandyRoe]

What's said in public and what's done in private may be two very different things. It's more than likely that there are informers in the congregation of Luton mosque and that al-Abdaly was known to the police.
But what could the informers have told the police? You don't need to be a Muslim to know of the plight of the Palestinians, or the Kashmiris, or Islamic people in areas of what was the Soviet Union.
"He's a man who talks of the oppression of our brothers in foreign countries." If that was enough to bring you to the attention of the police there would be more than Muslims on their lists.

[starone]

But jno, he wasn't making a religious statement, was he?

[naomi24]

Sandy, you make the grave mistake of assuming the people we're talking about are civilised and think logically. They're not and they don't. They are madmen. I have great sympathy for the plight of the Palestinians but I'm not planning to blow anyone up on their behalf. We can't afford to say 'what if?' - and we certainly can't afford to give them the benefit of the doubt. The simple fact is they are our enemy and if they had their way we would all be dead. In your failure to condemn them this is what you and jno and all the other apologists are actually supporting. I have to wonder whose side you people are actually on.

[sandyRoe]

Naomi, the leaders of the Luton mosque will still need to live in their community. They probably did tell the police about al-Abdaly, but they, for understandable reasons, aren't going to tell the wider world that they did.
I thought that it would go without saying that I condemn the murderous violence of the extremists.
Where in any of my posts have I ever been an apologist for murder?