Origin Of Information.

[Theland]

I believe all information originates in a mind.
If you disagree with this, any examples?

[Zacs-Master]

‘Count me out’

We already had.

[THECORBYLOON]

I think this thread is affected by the counter bug.

[Theland]

Without your mind to start things off, what do you think?

[Theland]

Zacs- you seem to enjoy your clique mentality.

[Gromit]

Information does not originate in the mind. It does not pop there from no where, suddenly appear to be broadcast by the owner of the mind.
Information is a set of observations of the physical world. The Brain analyses different bits of observations and tries to make sense of them. The ability to compile things you have seen, and then work out a possible meaning of it, is where knowledge comes from. If other people hear that knowledge, and agree with the reasoning behind the idea, then it will become accepted and repeated.
Over time though, new observations will mean that an old accepted idea my have to change, due to the new data.

[Theland]

Gromit - observations from the physical world?
Are you counting out abstract thought?

[THECORBYLOON]

Machines can be programmed to learn from previous outcomes. That new information is generated by the machine, not the human mind.

[Gromit]

Moses had look at his environment, and concocted a theory:
// God said, “Let there be a firmament in the midst of the waters, and let it divide the waters from the waters.” Thus God made the firmament, and divided the waters which were under the firmament from the waters which were above the firmament; and it was so. //

It seem to explain things, and people were happy to accept the idea for thousands of years.

And then we were able to fly to the heavens and observe new data and work out the cosmology of our universe. And poor old Moses ideas had to be ditched and new ones replaced it.

[Theland]

Yes machines can be programmed by ....... a programmer. With a mind.

[Theland]

Gromit - We have not worked out the cosmology of the universe.
Far from it.

[THECORBYLOON]

The mind produces the program but the computer adapts in ways without being specifically programmed to so.

[THECORBYLOON]

Anyway, what is this all leading up to?

[Theland]

Anything the computer does, originates in a human mind. Artificial Intelligence whilst autonomous to a great degree, originates in the human mind.

[Theland]

It is leading to the point that life requires information.

[bainbrig]

Interestingly, the Buddhist position on the mind/body is similar.

All things come from the mind, and thus ‘facts’ can only come from the mind. A rock might be a rock, but until a ‘mind’ sees and comprehends its ‘rockness’, it is nothing.

A positive aspect of this comes in times of adversity, when you realize that you are in charge of your problems. You can’t “think pain away”, but you can perhaps control your response to it.

[pixie374]

Life requires information... maybe. You seem to be confusing communication with origin though, theland. Like naomi, I am not quite sure what your point is (if there is one).

[pixie374]

All things are interpreted/misinterpreted by the mind. That is not where they come from though.

[woofgang]

pixie the mind in a coma is one of the damaged ones I was thinking of....and I am not sure that amoebas have minds, or brains. Since no one will define information...I will suggest that fot the purposes of this discussion, Information may be defined as "an external stimulus which is perceived by one or more of the senses and processed by the brain.....In fact I can't think of a single example of imformation, as I have defined it, that originates in a mind or a brain.

[pixie374]

I don't think it does originate there, woof. It is just interpreted there.

[pixie374]

Burns victims say, might be put in a coma, although there is nothing wrong with their mind. So their bodies can tick over on a "low level" and allow them to heal.

I have no idea what the point of my post just was lol. Or what anyone else is trying to say :-)